“My decision to stop iPhone development has had everything to do with Apple’s policies.” – Joe Hewitt
Facebook developer Joe Hewitt, the man behind the immensely popular Facebook application for iPhone, has just tweeted that he’s done with the project:
“Time for me to try something new. I’ve handed the Facebook iPhone app off to another engineer, and I’m onto a new project.”
We reached out to Hewitt for more details, and he attributed his decision to quit the project entirely on Apple’s tyrannical App Store approval policies:
My decision to stop iPhone development has had everything to do with Apple’s policies. I respect their right to manage their platform however they want, however I am philosophically opposed to the existence of their review process. I am very concerned that they are setting a horrible precedent for other software platforms, and soon gatekeepers will start infesting the lives of every software developer.
The web is still unrestricted and free, and so I am returning to my roots as a web developer. In the long term, I would like to be able to say that I helped to make the web the best mobile platform available, rather than being part of the transition to a world where every developer must go through a middleman to get their software in the hands of users.”
I couldn’t agree with Hewitt’s sentiments more, and it’s a breath of fresh air to see such a prominent developer quit the App Store. Apple has built some truly fantastic products, but their approach to the App Store is frightening — especially given the fact that other platforms may see the iPhone’s success and start adopting a similar model.
Hewitt’s move is a big deal, because he has essentially been the one-man show behind the iPhone’s most popular application of all time. Hewitt has been quite vocal about his opposition to Apple’s ridiculous App Store approval policies — in a post last August, he wrote that “the review process needs to be eliminated completely.” And to be clear, Hewitt is still at Facebook, though he can’t talk about the next project he’s working on.
Be sure to check out our TalkCrunch interview with Hewitt back in 2007, back when he had just launched the social network’s iPhone web app (note that the native iPhone app wasn’t released until summer 2008).
Hewitt joined Facebook in 2007 when it acquired Parakey, the company he co-founded with Blake Ross. Hewitt is also known for helping create the Firefox web browser as well as the popular Firebug development plugin.
Android? Maybe?
Hopefully Android.
Android?
Hopefully.
Android?
no. forget half-open platforms. web
Android?
like rats from a sinking ship at&t and apple yall had your chance and choose not to show love to the developers… they were doing your work for you and now yall suck…
This sounds like an interesting story but why is it I feel like we’re not getting all of it? I mean, a core developer quites a project has never been much of a news item in the past. The fact that TC decided to write about this and that FB is likely corroborating is what is intriguing. Could this in some way signal that FB is boycotting Apple’s app’s policy? Hard to tell. I think if they publicly stated their disapproval of Apple’s approval policy, their policy would get dissected and people would discover an interesting hypocrisy that lies beneath.
Joe did an amazing job on the app. I use it all the time. It’s really a pleasure to navigate between the views and check out what’s new. I wish he changes his mind and get busy with some of the essential features that are still missing, such as video playback for example…
Good job Joe!
So while I agree that this sucks for those of us who use the app, isn’t it at all obvious that Apple has EVERY RIGHT to approve work that goes on their platform? Software development for large corporate or mainstream platforms is COMMERCIAL and is not going to ever work in the OPEN SOURCE methodology that these Silicon Valley Hippies like Joe think it will.
The reason that Open Source will never prevail is that its not controlled. All Apple or any of these companies that gatekeeper their software development process are looking to do is appropriate Quality Control on their platform, as something this guy wanted to do might have caused stability issues with the iPod/iPhone OS itself, or maybe just broke some rules when it comes to the platforms capabilities.
People chastise companies for having control, but Apple has a product line and a reputation to protect. Don’t like it? Get a DROID, see how nicely thats supported in a few years when you’ll have to know how to compile C to get it to work with basic peripherals.
Bottom line: People pay more for quality – Free stuff is, has been, and always will be uncontrolled and more technical, and therefore the consumer will be less comfortable with it,
As for us geeks, open source is fine, but Apple’s not just selling to us – Most of their users are high school kids, soccer moms, and grandma, who got her first iPod Nano for Christmas to listen to her Sinatra “records” on…
If Joe ever worked for a REAL corporation outside of lalafornia, he’d know that checks and balances are constant and all bosses check your work, and you’re not the boss or expert just because you’re smart, or you do all the work. Sounds like he’s just being a bratty spoiled child who didn’t get his way.
God knows, at this point, the Android Facebook app could use some love. The integration in Android 2.0 is wonderful, but the standalone app still has issues.
Actually, so do MOST Android apps. The almost non existent bar for entry to the Android Market has done nothing but allow hundreds if not thousands of buggy, crash prone, half assed applications onto Android phones. It’s also opened the door to useless spam apps that exist solely to generate ad revenue from banner ad clickthroughs. I ditched my Android phone for an iPhone and don’t regret it at all. I haven’t found one single application that had banner adverts in it, but this was a regular find with Android apps. Also with Google getting cozy with Verizon and giving them Android 2.0 before anyone else, I questioned the openness of the whole platform. The list of Android bugs is pages long (don’t believe it? Check code.google.com yourself) and many of the bugs are just embarrassing.
There is a lot of cruft and banner-ad apps in the app-store actually Janey. And I say that as an iPhone user. AdMobile and a few companies like that specialise in them.
The problem the android had however is the original app store had no option for for-pay apps as far as I’m aware, meaning the only monetisation path was banner ads. Thats changed but the banner-ad hawkers are still lurking about.
He says web… I agree that the web needs some additional tools to make the mobile experience viable — on and off-line. I support Android as well as work in the iPhone space. And, the approval process has my life miserable this year!
I admire anybody who follows their beliefs, and I whole-heartedly agree.
I am sure, this is not an exception…many Apple developers may be thinking along those lines but may not have gathered the courage to make the move. This just makes it even more important to realize that 100,000 apps alone may not be enough to keep it going. Read more http://truvoipb...0-apps-opinion/
Doesn’t sound like Android from the one sentence he put.
“The web is still unrestricted and free, and so I am returning to my roots as a web developer.”
I would love to see him write a new facebook app for Android! The current one is crap.
maybe he got bored with a small app that only a few millions will use. surely there are bigger and more interesting projects in facebook
Per the Facebook for iPhone application page, the app has 17,342,832 monthly active users. Not exactly a “small” app.
(For comparison, Facebook for Blackberry has 10,938,482.)
See, irony IS hard!
I think someone doesn’t get sarcasm
for comparison, farmville 63,900,882. I still think there are more interesting things than farmville
As much as I don’t like Apple, the fact is this is how Apple operates and from what I can tell it is the thing all the fany boys like about them. They control everything and don’t proivde any choice.
I think it is their appstore and they don’t want just anything on there so they have approval. What is wrong with that? It is the Apple way. Why are people suddenly so pissed off by this. After all you can’t just install OSX on any computer. Why should apps be any different.
Incorrect. Fanboys like Apple because of the simplicity/ease of use, design, and reliability of their products.
The App store review process is unlike anything done anywhere else, including the OS X builds on desktop and laptop computers.
At least that’s what they say… but are the obvious reasons the true reasons ?
Sometimes it’s a pleasure to have a good choice made for you. For instance, instead of deciding whether or not I need a multi-touch trackpad on my laptop, Apple just decides that you need it. That’s a pleasure when it comes to buying a laptop, because I’ll reap the benefits later since OS X has already been responding to multi-touch for some time now.
And sometimes it’s a good thing to have less choice. Imagine pulling up to a gas pump and having to choose from 10 different types of gas! That would definitely not be a user-friendly experience. Often less is more….even though most people don’t realize it at first.
@ Phil
But the fact is that the fanbois who actually have a brain in the their head understand that many of apple’s advantages you speak of come because of the incredible amounts of control that they exhibit over their products. This is not even a question really it is just a matter of accepting this tradeoff. Apple’s past is littered with absurd contradictions of how cool and free the company makes people vs it real world policies.
As I have said here before – from the beginning Jobs never wanted users to have too much control because he knows what’s best. He did not want the original apple’s to even be expandable because he thought they were already perfect. (This was at the height of the homebrew scene.) The app store is the long coming culmination of this instinct and its spectacular success will only serve to harden that philosophy. This is not actually a knock because Jobs has often been right but if you don’t understand that apple’s advantages come from its control of nearly every aspect of its product then you are a mindless fanboi. Apple most assuredly does understand that that is where their advantages come from and they will continue to press the point.
The problem is the ridiculous rejections:
* Using a forbidden graphic (such as one that looks like an iPhone), even though other versions of the app, or other apps, have the same icon already.
* Citing customer confusion or duplication of functionality of a built-in app
a) how would they know customers would get confused until they release it?
b) It would be ridiculous to release an app that is a total clone of say Contacts or Camera, but if a dev makes an app that adds some features thaty Apple hasn’t or won’t add, they should be able to.
Not to mention the horrible response time. If customers find a bug, it can be weeks before an update gets approved and into their hands, leaving plenty of time for bad reviews (which are unfair) to pile up at the store.
I could go on, but the topic has been written about already by others.
But I think we hae to b realistic about we expect from Apple. They scaled from approving 0 applications to approving 100,000 applications. There are bound to be a significant number that they make the wrong decision on or they need to make a decision on to protect their platform. I don’t want a free for all on the iPhone. If there was, the iPhone would become like trying to mainitain Windows. Let’s praise them for what they are doing well and give them a break when it isn’t perfect.
Jeff, your reply got me thinking: I have heard the excuse of the 100,000 apps a lot now, the excuse being that seeing as there are so many apps coming at the app store, there are bound to be mistakes. But if you calculate that the app store is live now, what, since 1 year and 4 months. That’s roughly 485 days. That means an average of 206 apps per day. They probably also review quite a few apps that don’t make it, so let’s add a 100 per day to those 206.
So 306 apps per day. Recently I read an article that says they have 40 reviewers. That means they have to review about 7 apps per day per person. A little less than 1 per hour. That’s not so bad, right? Is it bad enough for the excuse that they have so much coming at them that they can’t handle things? And, if that was really the case; with the boatload of money they are making and the cash reserve of what, 37 billion, which Apple recently announced, I think review capacity is a very shitty excuse. And we’re not talking about a ‘few’ mistakes, were talking about loads of mistakes.
And “free for all” is not what people want; the apps should still be tested for functionality so as to keep your iPhone stable. They should however refrain from deciding for you and me what content we can and cannot handle!
Compare the app store to the movie industry: how would you like it if the rating agencies not only rated movies, but would decide to ban a movie that made fun of political figures, but not ban a movie with Asian chicks showing their fun bits? Freedom of choice is not just about the obvious perks for the consumer, it is about much more than that. You can’t have some company dictating what you can and cannot see/use, as it sets an awful precedent for future endeavors.
Your comparison is ironic because that’s how the major movie studios actually operate with respect to rating and depictions of sex and violence. If they decide not to classify a film, it’s a good as dead because it won’t get distribution.
100,000 apps, plus updates for most of them. Considering how many updates some apps get you could be looking at over a million app reviews, in which case your 1 app per hour becomes more like 1 app every six minutes.
I don’t know the exact process, maybe reviewers only check out the changes with updated apps, but it’s still a massive task.
I doubt Apple will keep the review process indefinitely, though not because of public pressure, more from the cost and strain on resources.
Kenny nailed that one. Very sadly ironic.
@ Adam True, forgot to take the updates into account, good point. But that’s still no excuse seeing as Apple has plenty of cash to hire more reviewers.
@ Kenney I agree, but many movies with sex and violence pass the rating all the time. I mean, stuff like Californication gets aired right (great series btw
), and many other series and films get passed that have quite the graphic stuff in them. They just get an R-rating and that’s that. However, it would be crazy if a movie that contains irony about a politican does not pass the rating, and that’s what I meant. That would mean “W” by Oliver Stone wouldn’t be allowed, but “Saw” would. And that is exactly what the app store is doing right now.
What about trying to be like Mac OS X? A Mac app doesn’t need to be approved by Apple. Why should the iPhone be more controlling than a mac?
If other apps already use it then thats confusing. If it is a trademark then legally they can’t let you use it or they lose the rights to it.
As far as customer confusion, I think apple know consumers pretty well. So many of the things they stay away from and other companies just jump on just because its possible fail miserably on other platforms until apple finds a way to make it use able. I really like that they try not to just throw stuff out there to see if it sticks. IF it interferes with their core design, REJECT IT. They understand why people are paying their cell bill every month. They must be doing something right because the give you what ever you want phones they the tech heads LOVE SOOOOO much
don’t seem to be able to make the regular consumers happy. Just look at the satisfaction scores.
You obviously are not listening to developers. Whatever a “fanboy” is and where one goes to look at their native habitat, I’ll leave to you. But, the approval process should be limited to code and leave content discussions to the market and standards of decency.
This will kill the ecosystem as Android evolves, and I know plenty of people who are switching to either other platforms or web technologies, and as Flash 10 is released — provided that Adobe doesn’t find a way to kill its possibilities — we will have another channel. Apple never intended for the app system to become the primary channel for development, but WebKit does not allow for content embedding/packaging. Apple probably does not want that either!
As the post above states, we like Apple and its technologies for generally being relatively open and elegant. It’s too bad that Apple has chosen to become the buzz-kill for the platform, but that is what they have done, and Joe’s decision is to be applauded.
Incorrect.
Fanboys always have a choice.
Go with Apple quality.
Or go with another vendor.
Everyone is free to choose. I usually choose Quality and that’s usually from Apple.
Nooooo, I liked him :’(
Where is 3.1 with notifications?
My guess is he’s submitted 3.1 and Apple keep rejecting it for whatever reason, hence this move.
Why can’t FB afford to pay for more than one engineer to work on “one of the iPhone’s most popular applications of all time”? I think Joe did a great job but there’s basic bugs like the fact that the times in events don’t respect timezone settings and so are hours out for most of the world that have never been fixed.
Because suckers like you don’t mind paying for substandard Crapple Apps!
You might want to consider that the Facebook iPhone app is free, pal.
It’s free you Jackass
He has done an amazing job on his own, and I’m sure Facebook would have given him a team if he wanted it. Too many cooks and all that.
So when your boss exposes scammers on FB, he’s a hero, but when Apple proactively keeps the App store clean, the’re tyrinnical.
You can keep the App Store clean without killing competition. You have a rather simplistic view.
Idiot. What about the 100,000 Apps?
zato – you should check the apps they have disapproved before assuming 100,000 apps means they are open to competition.
E.g. an app which allowed the old 2g phone to take video. That would compete with the later 3g phone which had video.
Idiot.
They don’t keep it clean, they’re keeping it the way they want it to be. Some would call it censorship…
“They don’t keep it clean, they’re keeping it the way they want it to be.”
It wouldn’t matter what they did. To a TC gamer/creep it would always be wrong,
and when Apple figure out how to charge you $49.95 for it, they will let you run apps that are not part of their approval process.
In fact, he did work with an intern this past summer, who influenced the mobile redesigns as well.
As far as I know, Facebook for iPhone has no ads. I mean, I know that it keeps people addicted to Facebook, but the app itself generates direct revenue for the company.
You can bet your last dollar (or euro) that FB will put ads into the mobile app eventually.
Why? I think it’s obvious by now that’s not their business. Their business is data…. (your data)…
http://bit.ly/delete-facebook
Facebook is evil, Google is evil, Microsoft is evil, Apple is evil, the government is evil. The Internet is evil.
Do us all a favor and go into the woods, live without the internet and any communication to other people. Then feel secure.
Yes, the whole freaking world is evil. blah. -.-
Sometimes you do not need more than one developer.
in the case of the facebook app, you do. it is the buggiest app among the most popular ones on the iphone.
On one hand the latest iPhone FB app is so much better and pretty impressive that one guy did it. One the other hand it is definitely just a starting point – it needs work, both bug fixes and new features. Now is the time to really ramp it up.
Yeah … what neoprenesuit said: buggy as hell. Of course, that may be a result of the review process. Cumbersome process means simple bug fixes aren’t pushed out the door quietly, but lumped into larger releases where more bugs are waiting. So the end-user never perceives a net improvement.
The Droid Market needs your apps. Come on over! Freedom!
Why is everyone jumping on the Google Android bandwagon so readily. Yes, it’s cool software but when is Google going to know enough about you for you to feel like your entire life is visible to this company?
Because Android needs great apps with great app experiences in order to fight the iPhone. If he is so fed up with the App Store, why not switch over to Android full time?
I doubt that he is running over to Android. The platform needs some more work, which I am quite sure will happen. But as he states, web applications do not require a gatekeeper.
“Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.”
The only difference between Google, and every other company on the web is Google is honest about tracking your data.
Also, technically Android =/= Google, the OS itself is benign, and if you don’t believe you can always check and change the source, using Google apps and services will feed them data, but not the phone itself.
This is a bit rubbish! He’s a talented guy and I’m sure his next venture will be a success!!
Sounds like a whiny primadonna to me. Of course, from his perspective their should be no approval process to support his vision for a free, open and unfettered Internet. Get real dude.
Yeah, he’s totally out of line. It’s not like the web lets you just put whatever you want out there without getting it approved first.
Oh wait, yes it does.
Probably you are an Apple Fanboy who can’t listen to anything against Apple. Read what he says again
Probably only code review should taken up. Plus the approval process is still kept in the dark. They cite stupid reasons for rejection
Oh BTW He is getting real, you need to come out of your burrow.
I believe FaceBook to be the largest walled-garden ever conceived, so I can’t help but feel this is a huge irony. If FB was so great, why isn’t it just “open”.
Whilst Apple are not perfect, and they have admitted this, they must be doing something right – they just need to back off a bit with exactly what they are doing, and perhaps publish their approval guidelines. That might be nice.
That’s funny and true. Never thought about it that way.
I believe FaceBook to be the largest walled-garden ever conceived
change this to:
I believe Apple to be the largest walled-garden ever conceived
History is the proof.
I suppose we will see won’t we. Perhaps Apple’s next step is to restrict what websites owners can browse.
Please note the sarcasm in my reply.
Whiny primadonna he is not, I can assure you of that. For all the hype that the Facebook app has brought him, Joe is probably one of the most unassuming people you’d ever meet.
Apple has taken too long with their approval process. why would soemone so talented put up with that?
Well said Eric!
Wake up Apple you stubborn idiots.
This is why my post about Motorola’s Droid not being all that great when compared to iPhone doesn’t matter. It’s all about the apps and one of the most important ones is the Facebook app (which sucks on Android and is really nice on iPhone, due to Hewitt’s brilliance). If he, and other key developers, move from iPhone onto Android it’s over.
Apple’s hard-handedness on apps is ALONE why I am not returning my Droid, even though the Droid isn’t a great product.
Can’t wait to see what Hewitt does next.
Inside baseball, inside baseball, inside baseball.
Developers aren’t going to jump ship from a sailing platform. Period. It’s a big ocean.
Would you invest s**tloads of your time and effort developing something that might be knocked back for no reason?
Big developers are pretty much guaranteed (as long as they are cosy with apple) to be published, but the small guys have no guarantee.
That’s probably why you have so many novelty apps – where the effort is minimal and only a few professional apps.
Isn’t that the way with writing a novel, a screenplay, an invention, and pretty much everything else in the world?
Normally it depends on the quality of your work and your presentation. Not someone’s unaccountable whim.
But whatever, use whatever you want. Fanboys have an answer for everything. When the rest of the world has moved to android, I’m sure you’ll be happy on your iPhone … just like when the rest of the world moved to Windows (for the same reqsons – an open ecosystem) the fanboys stayed with Mac.
BTW if you want to see this Mac obsessive control, try and join the made for iPhone program. We’ve tried, and its ridiculous what they expect you to agree to.
Agree with you Robert, I have recently bought a HTC Hero and whilst I think it is a great phone, Android still has some way to go, but I think that it is definitely the future for integrated mobile OSs. By integrated I mean the contacts that integrate with GContacts and Facebook etc.
Personally I see Facebook becoming the ‘white Pages’ or telephone book of the future. Everyone will be on Facebook or its successor and it will be how you get in contact with people.
Hewitt’s is a religious war by what seems to be a temperamental developer. There’s probably a few other cultists out there but not enough to dent Apple. And who knows how long it will take Android to get up to iPhone quality (Apple’s not standing still) and even if it does the whole Android thing could fragment. And, what happens to Android if iPhone hits Verizon, half (or more) the reason for going Android is the network.
Except you can only load 256 MB of apps on even the new Android devices, that’s like 20-30 apps, and no nice 3D like ones! Major problem for Android platform IMO.
While this is partly to blame on the platform, a lot rests in the manufacturers hands, if one of them would build a phone with more internal memory we wouldn’t even be talking about this.
That being said it’s been reported that the Android team is actually addressing this to make it possible to securely install apps on the SD card so then it won’t matter anymore. Also, larger apps can be created currently if they take care and download/store the large assets on your SD card.
That’s false/misleading.
Android apps store their main data/assets outside of ROM (e.g. on the SD card). You’ll even be able to load entire apps from online storage, with upcoming updates.
1. Droid is perfectly capable of loading the same big apps, including the same 3D apps.
2. Droid can even have a lot more apps. iPhone imposes a limitation of 9 pages (148 icons). Android doesn’t have that limitation.
3. Droid has a better screen at that.
Uh.. wrong. Very few Android apps are more than 1MB, and only the executable part of an app needs to be on the internal memory. Game devs can store graphics/sound/etc on the SD card so the hit on internal memory can still be very small.
This is definitely a somewhat lame imitation but it’s not as bad all the iPhone fanboys keep ranting about and I’m sick of hearing it. It is *not* a problem, at all, period. Trust me. I’ve owned two Android phones, and never even come close to filling up the internal memory.
It is a problem for potential developers looking for a platform. You may feel otherwise, but I would like to see equal development possibilities on Android. This is not going to happen without issues like this not only being solved but never causing a concern to begin with.
I have a single app that is 200 meg…
Sean, you may not see it as an end user, but anything that keeps developers from being able to easily get their app done IS an issue and WILL affect the quality of apps that you eventually end up using.
This storage issue is a problem.
That said, the root of the issue is cheap-ass manufacturers that don’t want to pay for internal memory and would rather throw a cheap SD card in there instead, ignoring all the downsides (such as this) to that approach.
I don’t care about the specs. Let me know if it works with iTunes and iPhoto.
iPhone will be like supporting IE6 (or IE in general maybe). The sheer numbers demand it. Even as people embrace Android and it becomes bigger, developers will be forced to cater to the huge percentage of people who prefer or are content with Apple’s control. So it won’t be over for ‘em anytime soon at least.
I’m curious about how malware will be handled when the Android Market hits critical mass.
We all admire Joe’s work! but would you not agree that the success stories from Apple we all admire are partly due to their (review) processes?
Joe – you are ready for somethung bigger!!!
web developer? hmmm why not join me and the rest of the web developers and code for the awesome and FREE webos?
Yes. If you actually want and Open platform AND Web standards, the WebOS users want a great Facebook app!
well, that’s a shame, the Facebook iPhone app is one of the best iPhone apps around.
But I think his decision might be understandable. There’s something North Korean about Apple’s reviewing process, and it won’t get less as more developers want to release their apps on the iPhone.
At some point Apple will have to let go of the full control, and maybe have “featured apps” (i.e. fully checked as is now) and “legal apps” (i.e. all other apps that do not do anything illegal like copyright theft). Open is the way to go, even if you’re called Apple
From Joe’s Blog : http://bit.ly/quit-iphone
“I’d like to add my voice to the stream of complaints about the iPhone App Store, but before I say anything critical, I have to promise one thing. No matter how annoyed I get, I will not stop developing for Apple’s platforms or using Apple’s products as long as they continue to produce the best stuff on the market.”
So I take it Apple’s platform isn’t the best stuff on the market anymore?
Like they say, never say never.
He might go back to OS X pretty soon after being bored with Web apps.
Or being bored no one cares anymore… Build a good iPhone App, people notice.
This is why we love capitalism and freedom!
If you don’t like something, you quite and start working on something else. No one is forcing you, no one is controlling you.
No deal is done unless both parties accept and benefit! This is capitalism and freedom, may it still last.
That is awesome… I quite the iPhone altogether even though its the most powerful and best phone ever. It will hold that title for awhile but I can not deal with the limited usability of a device capable of so much more. Which by the way I paid full price for. Thats like buying a car and being told that you can’t speed, or go out of town, or change the color if you choose. I had my phone Jail Broken but it boiled down to the principle of it all. I don’t like my new phone but at least I can do what I want with it. My money, my phone, my chose.
You’re a retard.
Being a videogame developer, the approval process is nothing new on any videogame console, be it Playstation, Xbox, or any other. All console manufacturers “wall their gardens”, Apple is not the first company to do it, nor the last.
That said, some companies (Microsoft as an example) do put a considerable effort into making this process as smooth as possible and provide as much support for developers as possible, which does bring a competitive advantage to their platforms.
While “walled gardens” are necessary to preserve the app quality, it is a restrictive mechanism and I do think that developers should pick and choose the platform providers over their policies, if for nothing else than to force them to compete and provide better support for developers.
It’s not the walled garden that annoys developers, we all understand why it’s there. It’s the fact that when Apple decides not to let your app THROUGH the walled garden, the reasons they give are incredibly vague, if at all useful. And they are horribly inconsistent in applying their rules as well.
At the very least, it’s pretty clear what a console developer can and can’t get away with in a game on the big 3. And if there’s any doubt, I’m sure a developer can go up to each of their developer relations departments and inquire about the validity of ideas. But with Apple, it’s WAY too easy to sink 6 months into a project and finish it, only to be rejected or stuck in limbo for the stupidest of reasons.
And that’s where, while Apple probably has the best development platform, their app store approval policies will be the death of their runaway success (and it’ll will become one platform among many again).
I get your point, Jeff, and I do agree with you.
I don’t defend Apple’s horrendous approval process. And we’ve seen in the past worse hoops on other platforms – like having to translate your dev documentation from Japanese, or solder together interface boards just to be able to access the device, just to name a few.
Companies that are not considerate towards developers are guaranteed to lose their market supremacy. It happened to every single one of them and it will happen to Apple as well if they don’t address it.
It seemed to me, though, that Joe is not familiar with the development on proprietary devices and the presence of an approval process was an unexpected surprise for him.
He states – “I am philosophically opposed to the existence of their review process” (and I don’t think it’s taken out of context, if you read his whole statement). This begs the question – why did he go into it in the first place then? Just to make a big show of himself later admitting he had no idea what is it he’s getting into?
I do respect his choice to develop for the “unrestricted web”. There is the parallel of developing games for PC vs. the consoles. Each has its advantages and drawbacks. What I didn’t agree with is mixing market realities, personal preferences and Apple’s shortcomings in a skewed ego-centric statement.
front page material.
Some Facebook developers will have quit the Facebook platform, saying exactly what Hewitt says: “I would like to be able to say that I helped to make the web the best mobile platform available, rather than being part of the transition to a world where every developer must go through a middleman to get their software in the hands of users”. Facebook has been a very open middleman when compared with Apple, but its still a middle man.
Just think about what you would need to do to replicate Joe’s Facebook app — you would have TWO middlemen to be paranoid about taking your app down.
Hats off to Hewitt to sticking to principles, he is the developers developer.
And should probably be fired for being so public about them. I never knew employers were this lax about contracts – you know, he’s paid to develop. If he doesn’t like it, tough, money is changing hands.
It sounds like a publicity stunt to me.
You do realize that he’s not just “any” developer right? Facebook paid a tidy sum for his company (Parakey). He’s more of a rock star developer.
So he’s allowed to run amok and say what he wants to the media? Facebook needs to protect themselves more. He probably walks the aisles there like some kind of special case that gets to do and say what he wants. This guy couldn’t hold down a job in the mailroom of a real company with this attitude that he should be “free”… I’m a director in a large IT company that serves customers all over the world, and let me tell you, even with my level of management responsibility, there is even someone telling the CEO when he can talk to the media and what about…
Wow that blows he did a great job improving the new app.
Apple needs to start working with people they are sounding like record labels not working with technology.
I think earning a few hundred thousand bucks from the Apple app store will change any programmer’s mind.
I guess it’s just that Facebook paid him a fixed salary.
BFD.
no review process? are you guys crazy? I am sorry, but all this happy talk about free apps and the like is nuts. we are talking about mobile phones here. mobile phones are used by way more people than PC web users and they want their phones to work.
no review process … let’s talk about that once the first app is being distributed that either contains a virus or worse a hidden phishing/spy app.
I’m not an iPhone dev, but Hewitt was for a long time. This is what he wrote in his post about your concern:
Oh, but you say that iPhone apps are different, because they run native code and can do scary things that web pages can’t? Again, you’re wrong, because iPhone apps are sandboxed and have scarcely any more privileges than a web app. About the only scary thing they can do outside the sandbox is access your address book, but Apple can easily fix that by requiring they ask permission first, just like they must do to track your location.
i don’t think anyone is averse to screening out apps that are legitimate malware. any open source repo (ubuntu, debian, redhat etc) does the same. hewitt is talking about the capricious, confusing, and often manipulative traits apple has demonstrated
4.6 billion people vs 1.67 billion. How many of the four billion people with phones have a phone even capable of having 3rd-party apps on it? I’m not even sure what this comparison has to do with your argument. And the last time I checked, PC users wanted their computers to work.
Do you have any idea how locked down application development for phones is? It’s not like software development on PCs where you can delete someone’s entire hard drive while they’re not looking.
If the industry hinges on applications being “reviewed” by a 3rd party before they can be deployed, there’s something wrong there. Numerous ways around the review process already exist. Developers can sneak time-sensitive functionality in that the reviewers wouldn’t see and get the app “approved”. Like in the desktop software and online app industries, people should be able to make an intelligent decision on whether or not to use an app they run across… rather than relying on someone hundreds of miles away to decide for them. Heck, if this leads to an opening for anti-virus vendors, so be it. Dependence on application review is just careless.
That article is incredibly misleading. It’s laughable to think there are actually 4.6 billion unique mobile phone users.
It’s “4.6 billion global mobile subscriptions.” Lot’s of people especially overseas have several phones per person.
More people use toilet paper than mobile phones.
I think we should start developing for toilet paper.
Sure, but how about legitimate developers who have been left with no feedback whatsoever from Apple? A rejection, that’s one thing. You can either act on it, or move along. But there are cases of developers being left hanging for months on end without any feedback from Apple other than ‘your app is in review; we have no other information.’
Rachel: Good point – I would argue that Apple has every right to review and reject whatever they want, but there’s no reason why it takes forever, and they can’t tell you clearly WHY it was rejected.
Thanks for a logical point and argument on here.
Jason,
Do you genuinely view Apple’s policies (as distinct from how well they execute them) as “tyrannical” and “ridiculous”? do you believe that their should be no review process at all, as you say that the FB guy suggests?
I’m not sure why this is big news. This is a single app developer at FB. He can make the big deal “statement” that he did because he knows FB has a ton of other developers who can step in to keep programming for the iPhone. If he were the only one who could create an iPhone app at FB, and FB’s ability to appear on the iPhone could happen only through him, do you really think he would have been allowed to quit a project like that? So he has an opinion and he jumped off a project because he didn’t like the policies of the vendor. Good for him but not a big deal for us. It would be a big deal if FB itself jumped off the iPhone in protest but for a single employee at a huge company to jump? Please.
Should Apple let all apps into the app store and onto the iphone un-reviewed? if so, wouldn’t the app store be filled up with even more noise? wouldn’t app developers start complaining about how there is too much crAPP to weed through to get to their non-crapp apps? would this be a benefit to the majority of Apple’s customers? how would Apple enforce the agreements it has with its partner carriers? how would Apple prevent certain kinds of apps it categorically does not want to carry? (e.g., hard core porn)
You note that Apple has established a dangerous precedent here with its review process and that others may follow. If others do follow, why do you suppose they would follow? Is it because that the review process is in some way helping make the customer experience better? or are the “others” (who are you worried about specifically?) just so _stupid_ that they would copy Apple blindly to do anything to emulate their success?
So, two cheers for the FB developer for quitting the iPhone project for living by his convictions and one cheer for Techcrunch for making such a big deal of it. In the scheme of things, is it really that big a deal? The FB app is popular on the iPhone not because it is the most creative paradigm busting envelope-pushing artful unique app out there. It’s popular because it’s the onramp to FB, and FB is huge.
Who cares. Get a life and grow up.
maybe he should try and look at it from a user’s perspective; for a user, it is reassuring to know that the app you’re downloading has been vetted.
Really? You need someone to hold your hand before you trust something? I quote Joe himself: “If you think that all apps should be held prisoner by Apple until proven safe, you should also be able to convince yourself that this is how the web should work.”
Tell that to the jailbroken iPhone guys that got their data stolen.
Their fault for not changing their root password and Apple’s fault for forcing people to jailbreak to get the most out of the device.
Really? Is the web a product I purchased from a company with an expected level of performance? No. So why would I expect it to work like one? That quote alone is enough for me not to care about this guy, not that I ever did to begin with.
Reality check – the facebook app is popular because facebook is popular, and the iPhone is popular. It shouldn’t be difficult to add 2+2. The app isn’t particularly good, it’s better now than it was, but it’s still pert mediocre all around. The app is a success despite who the dev was. Not that any significant number of the 17+ million users care who he was or that he’s leaving.
Are there problems with Apple’s review process? Of course. Is it successful? Astronomically so. Things will get better, slowly, because things aren’t as broken as some would have us believe.
As it is, the Web today is the source of lots of security risks.
So we should have a secure “app browser” to do the job that Apple’s engineers are doing, vetting code?
yeah let’s all go back to AOL! (This time the A stands for Apple)
Hello people. The emperor has no clothes. Since Joe Hewitt took over he has introduced more bugs into an app that only has to make API calls. He needs a gut check, I doubt he decided to leave. I have been asking him to leave for months.
I agree.
In fact it always amazes me that people think programmers are like super geniuses.
Maybe if people actually learned how to program they would realize it’s not actually that hard. Especially on today’s platforms such as Apple’s.
I and any programmer can literally make a simple iPhone application in 5 minutes. To make that get some stuff from the Internet, maybe another 10 minutes.
Are you serious? I am exploding with laughter!
“I am very concerned that they are setting a horrible precedent for other software platforms, and soon gatekeepers will start infesting the lives of every software developer.”
This is for sure calling the kettle black. Has he even tried to develop on the Facebook platform?!! App shut downs (with no notice), a changing platform that could care less about developers. I sure hope he doesn’t try to develop on his own Platform, he will quit within a week.
There do not exist enough +’s to indicate the insight in this comment.
Sorry, Joe, but your employer’s walled garden puts all others — including the iTunes store — to shame.
facebook api is a nightmare!
COMPLETELY AGREE!
Cold hard truth right there.
Hahaha. Indeed.
Another silly thing is TC is the same blog that is calling out Facebook for “Scamville” and not properly vetting their apps, because they make money off the scams. That’s pretty ridiculous to then call Apple out for being at the other end of the spectrum. Both are bad in different ways, but at the end of the day, at least the iPhone users are getting scammed by approved apps.
er… “at least the iPhone users AREN’T getting scammed”
At first I thought the title read that he had decided to quit over “Apple Tranny” — but yeah more power to this guy.
I still believe that Apple should adopt some sort of verification system for the App Store.
If you are a well known developer then your application will be published right away and reviewed later.
If you are a no-namer then your app will go through the horrendous approval process before going live.
I think that is a fair way to go about this situation.
ding ding ding! Good idea!
there’s an app for that
more like theres a slap for that.
alright, that’s funny
Don’t think it’s Android since he wants to go back web.
Nonetheless, I love his stance and the message he is sending.
Impressive, I applaud Joe. Gina Trapani took a similar stance some time ago: http://bit.ly/wU65m .
Hopefully talented people like Joe and Gina can create compelling apps for alternative platforms, helping Apple find the way.
You should learn to read because these are two different statements. Gina is a dingbat anyway and I have no interest in anything she has to say.
From Joe Hewitt, August 2009:
“I’d like to add my voice to the stream of complaints about the iPhone App Store, but before I say anything critical, I have to promise one thing. No matter how annoyed I get, I will not stop developing for Apple’s platforms or using Apple’s products as long as they continue to produce the best stuff on the market. ”
Guess not, huh, Joe?
Well, maybe he changed his mind after three months of increasing frustration.
What a primadonna. Apple has the only successful mobile app store in the world and this joker thinks he knows better? Good luck, don’t let the door hit you on the way out.
*facepalm*
Wow. Really? You would type this using what I’m assuming is your real name?
Epic dunce….
Hewitt can build the most popular mobile application in history.
You can talk trash under a pseudonym.
And *he’s* the joker?
I think most of the people are missing the point here. As someone who has had to deal with Apple’s App Store review process I can say that Apple displays zero interest in assisting developers in getting their apps approved. It’s fine to have a strict review process but be consistent with it. One of my apps was approved and then an update was unapproved because it “mimicked” the functionality of an existing website – like DUH. It’s my website you boneheads. Didn’t you notice? You approved it the first time.
It’s ticky-tack crap like that which makes developers want to go on a kitten kicking spree. Our time is valuable and we expect to be treated with respect.
It’s obvious that change will happen in this space. Apple is still a minor player in the overall scheme of things. They can get squashed faster than you might think. Which is ironic because it’s happened to Apple before.
Apple has never been squashed. What are you talking about?
In fact, Apple has been super resilient DESPITE all the challenges thrown at it.
If a guy survives a firestorm, what do you call him?
TOUGH!
I want to thank Apple for protecting my device from bad apps.
No one blames developers for making an app that crashes yout iPhone – we all point to Apple. Then we hear “iPhone sucks”.
Or – remember the “baby” app?
The baby shaking app was approved BY Apple before it hit the headlines and was then removed. You may also want to thank Apple for handicapping some potentially great apps like Google Latitude. But I guess its fine to be told what to install when brains don’t come as standard…
I personally don’t agree entirely with Joe. The iPhone platform has been such a magnet for money-grabbers, a gatekeeper is necessary to keep the malicious ones out. It’s so quick and easy to install an application onto the iPhone, it would be way too easy for someone to install a malicious app that wreaks havoc on innocent customers.
I think people miss this point. Apple does consumers a service, even if it does inconvenience developers or even slightly handicap them. As a consumer I appreciate the review process and I trust the iPhone apps. I can’t say the same for Android at this point, though I agree it offers more freedom and innovation may appear there first. No big deal to me, the consumer: iPhones will always have great apps, and Android is a nice alternative.
As for a rock star developer complaining about Apple, more power to him. This is how opinions get formed, feedback gets delivered, and subtle changes occur to review processes over time. I’m sure Apple listens, just like everybody else.
Yeah like that Pakistan guy who made all those crap apps!
Here here!
I had an app that sold 10,000 copies and a policy change in the app store prevented me from providing an update to the app when 3.1 came out. All users who upgraded their phone OS suddenly had a broken app.
Sad part is I had the fixed app on MY phone, and could prove to people we had fixed the problem, but I couldn’t distribute the fix to people on the app store!
WTF Apple.
what are you talking about?
iPhone has 2 application environments, each of which is the total opposite of the other:
- CocoaTouch apps that are made with Apple tools and methods, and which have to be approved by Apple and install from the iPhone App Store
- HTML5 apps that do not require any approvals, which are made with any tools and with W3C methods, and which install from your own Web server
When you consider that these represent by far the best native app platform and best Web app platform on a phone today, I have no sympathy for developers who complain about Apple. Especially when these same jokers have XBox or PlayStation or Nintendo (all more closed than iPhone App Store) or they have Windows (where the native app platform has no security and the Web app platform is closed and proprietary). The hypocrisy of these false martyrs is astonishing.
What a crock. Talk about hyping a non-story. He is opposed to the “existence” of a review process? Then he should not develop for Android because they have one too. Or he could write Windows Mobile garbage which crashes left and right because there are no standards and no checks on quality. one of many reasons why WM is close to dead. This has no impact on the iPhone Facebook app at all and of course is not a big deal. At all. I don’t know if the writer of this article is he bigger fool or this ego=maniacal developer. Tyrannical, what an ass.
Link to the “android review process”?
…and nothing of value was lost.
Sounds to me like a prima donna coder got bored of working in an unrefactorable pile and decided to move on to the Next Big Thing, as many so-called developers tend to do
Oh my, this is bad. Apple need to change the App Store approval process asap. Stories like this are becoming more popular and as Apple starts to have more competition keeping developers happy will be and should be something they focus on. This is just bad PR for the Apple and the App Store.
Now, I’m like the rest of you, status on Facebook 3.1 with push notifications?
From August 24th, 2009:
“I’d like to add my voice to the stream of complaints about the iPhone App Store, but before I say anything critical, I have to promise one thing. No matter how annoyed I get, I will not stop developing for Apple’s platforms or using Apple’s products as long as they continue to produce the best stuff on the market. I never forget how deeply Apple cares about making their users happy, and that counts more than how they treat their developers. Besides, when I have a problem with a friend, I don’t threaten to boycott our friendship until they change, so I’m not going to do that to Apple either.”
Sounds like Mr. Hewitt spoke a little rashly not so many months ago. Of course it could also be him speaking rashly now, as many commenters are suggesting, i.e. that this is not such a big event considering there are plenty of other programmers at FB that can – and I am assuming, will – take up development of FB’s iPhone app.
It’s a little disingenuous of anyone to say this is any sort of milestone or grand statement: Hewitt still has a job – “web development”? Hmph, he works for Facebook, let’s be frank – and nobody is losing access to a insanely popular social-networking platform.
Obviously this is 100% Joe’s call to leave.
That said, this shouldn’t be blown out of proportion. There is evidence that he is a good developer of iPhone apps, but there’s no evidence he’s the Pied Piper. The guy has been successful mostly because he created the only official application for the most popular social networking site on the the fastest growing platform. It’s not as if his app was astonishing in any way. I never did understand how FB let him communicate with the world about apps in development anyway. The App Store will survive. In fact it will continue to dominate without Joe.
Either way, best of luck Joe. Hope you find a better project out there!
Peter your are right.
Is this why there are so many crappy annoying apps on facebook?
+1
@polyGeek…
“Our time is valuable and we expect to be treated with respect.”
Guess what? My time is more valuable than yours… Do you want my money? If so, make an app for the iPhone, if not… I don’t think I’ll miss you.
No big loss here. The iPhone Facebook app sucks anyway. The UI is complete nonsense. Good riddance.
Weird that the most popular app in the stores sucks! Doesn’t speak well of the store at all does it?
maybe the facebook app will become good now?
right said