Despite our best intentions, it looks like the DEMO v. TechCrunch50 war will continue, even with DEMO under new management.
In 2007 we launched the first TechCrunch50 event – a place where companies can launch to rabid fans and tech press. These launching companies are the stars of the show, and they don’t pay a cent to attend. We thought DEMO’s longstanding policy of forcing launching companies to pay a $20,000 fee was ridiculous, and led the conference organizers to make decisions based not on the merits of the startups but simply on who was willing and able to pay. Not only do we let startups launch for free, we give the top one a $50,000 prize.
Our conference has grown rapidly – nearly 2,000 people attended TechCrunch50 last year while DEMO languished in San Diego with a paltry few hundred. To be fair, our events were on the exact same dates, so they were hit doubly hard. This year we moved our dates to give them some breathing room. We thought we were done battling DEMO.
But today DEMO announced that they’re giving away a “massive” prize – $2 million in advertising credits – to the top two startups at the event. The press is eating it up, saying that TechCrunch50 looks paltry in comparison.
Of course, there’s a catch. The “advertising” is remnant stuff on IDG properties (IDG owns DEMO) and will certainly be priced at rate card. They’ll also charge for creative and other expenses. Meaning there is very little actual value. I’m guessing that the amount of advertising actually delivered would be in the tens of thousands of dollars of value, at best. And, of course, every startup launching still needs to pay to launch.
But whatever. You want adverting? We’ll give you advertising.
DEMO says they’ll give away $2 million in advertising (it might be $1 million total, they aren’t very clear). We’ll double whatever they’re giving. We’ll give away $4 million in advertising if they’re giving $2 million. And if DEMO increases their number, we’ll increase ours to stay at 2x whatever they are at. Our ads will be on our various TechCrunch networks sites and via our terrific sponsors, who are going to be adding their own inventory as well. We’ll give half to the top two winners, and half to everyone else who launches.
We’ve always supported the startups that launch at TechCrunch50 in every way we can. Throwing in free advertising is easy.
Let’s just take a look at the two events for comparison purposes.
TechCrunch50: Free to launch, 2,000 attendees, $50,000 cash prize to winner. $4 million in free advertising. Awesomeness in a bottle.
DEMO: $20,000 to launch your startup, maybe 500 attendees, $1 million in remnant unsold advertising on IDG properties to each of top two startups.
The choice seems pretty clear to me.
Thanks for the link love Mike, I’ll see you in September.
sure.
you know, i’m pretty sure after reading and re-reading their press release that DEMO is only doing $1 million, not $2. They don’t seem to be correcting other press, though, saying $2 million. But whatever, we’ll just do double what they do.
Yeah, I thought the same thing. I said: ” two winners selected by the judges will receive a combination of $1,000,000 in advertisements through media partners..”
I never saw two million total, except in Allen’s numbers. Doubling it is still great Mike, big points for helping the new guys.
Smart move, Mike. You’re gonna fuckin bury DEMO
i thought we already did. honestly, they need to dump the pay to launch fees.
I love Techcrunch, you guys kick DEMO’s ASS
“where is the love, where is the love, WHERE IS THE LOVE, THE LOVE, THE LOVE”
- Black Eyed Peas
I thought it was appropriate
A startup needs every penny they can get/have. Doesn’t DEMO understands that?? Too bad for them because Techcrunch 50 does.
Congratulations for the initiative, Mike. DEMO has the choice to wake up or die in its sleep. They’ve been warned…
Michael, is there anything that violates anti-trust laws here? If Demo will drop their fees to zero, is that regarded as anti-competitive to TechCrunch50 or not?
Just curious as you perhaps know my stand on anti-trust laws is that it should be killed because it violates individual rights. As a lawyer yourself, but I can interpret the non-objective anti-trust laws that if Demo drops their fees to zero, then it is anti-competitive and should be prosecuted for doing so. If Demo drops their fees and make it free (ie, zero fees), then what they’re doing would be no difference to what Microsoft did when they bundled the IE browser with their own Windows, which they made it free and DOJ stepped in to prosecute them.
You can probably see, that if the scenario I am citing above does happen, my interpretation of the anti-trust laws, I can find that there is a case for Demo to answer because the anti-trust is non-objective, I can interpret it to be that exactly, they’re committing anti-competitive against TC50 if they make theirs free entry with no fees paid.
The point that I am making here, is that you have (the businessman has) no prior knowledge of what is allowed and what not, since anti-trust laws is non-objective and arbitrary.
Just think about it.
Agreed, I live in SD, and their model is snakeoil at 20k.. what a scam..
Falafulu Fisi – err, no. this is sort of the opposite of an antitrust violation.
now, if we got together with demo and decided to split the pie, and each charge say $10k, then people start to go to jail. I don’t see that happening.
Michael’s approach is clear…Kill ‘Demo’…And i’m absolutely fine with it
Haha, I’m sorry. I gotta good laugh out of this.
i dont get the bitterness here mikey, am i missing something? this is America, we can charge whatever we feel like and if there is a buyer, great, if not, well, it was priced too high. supply and demand.
to me, it is TC that is being the bully here: why did you plan your TC50 (last year) on the same date as Demo? why are you doubling their “prize money”? stop bullying and work together for once. nobody wins if the start-ups can’t focus their energy.
Cause Michael is god.
Where have you been you silly person?
bullying? I just gave away $4 million in advertising.
bullying? It’s being competitive with other companies, not bullying.
plus at least we acknowledge their existence. no mention of techcrunch50 in their press release.
Providing an alternative to established players will always be met by aggressive one-upmanship. The DeadMule did this with the good ‘ole boy network of Southern Lit. in Chapel Hill, NC.
I am rather enjoying his good old fashioned rivalry. Would be sad to see DEMO, which some of us love to hate, go.
If I were a startup, I’d rather launch at Techcrunch 50 just because its Free and by a very popular news network. The rest is frankly just bonuses.
Wow.. Michael, i’ve never seen anyone actually take a shit on their competitor before!! Love it!!!
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
One word…… OWNED!!!!!!!!!
That is the perfect response
But how much do you charge to be in the demo pit? $3k? And how many companies did you invite to the demo pit? 200? Lameness in a bottle.
I’m not sure what we’re charging for sponsors this year. But we love the demo pit companies. Total, beautiful chaos. People love it. Plus, the small amount they pay allows us to actually put on the event and let 50 awesome startups launch for free.
If you love them so much then should let them demo for “free” — just like you let the other 50.
Don’t see you let companies demo for free if you are actually charging 75% of them $3k.
“say”
probably. but we definitely don’t love them as much, which is why they have to pay to have a demo booth at the event.
plus, if we didn’t do this, we couldn’t put on the event. We don’t get millions in pay per launch fees like demo does.
And how exactly is giving $50k to a Twitter clone that was created by Geni.com “helping startups?”
Yammer was not a startup, it was a side project from a company that raised over $11 million from CRV and The Founders Fund.
you are all over the place. focus will make you a much better troll in the long run.
++
+1
Gotta stay with me here. This is important.
Geni.com (parent company of Yammer.com — the company you declared the winner of TechCrunch50) – was not a startup. As of September 2008, they had raised $11 million from CRV and The Founders Fund.
So, not only did you award “The Best Startup” to a company with millions in funding, but you awarded it to a Twitter clone.
Capice?
oh i see, you want the award to go to the startup that needs it the most, not the startup that wins on the merits. got it. yeah, we’re not doing that.
Ah, so if I white label FriendFeed or Facebook, I have enough merit to win? Got it.
Everyone hear that? Clones win.
keep trying.
Please explain to us how Yammer was so innovative…
The entire valley is waiting…
http://siteanal...com/yammer.com/
OMG ‘Wow’. You got pwn’d by Arrington fair and square.
I love this cat fight. Getting more pop-corn…
Ouch. I don’t know the back story of who / what DEMO is but all I can say is I hope they deserve it…
I agree that taking money from the little guys trying to start up is a deplorable business to be in…
$1 billion dollars! Mwuhahaha.
Too many colors on demo my eyes imploded
Having read the article seriously, I think TechCrunch Model makes more sense. I am the founder of http://TwitSnaps.com and I am looking at it from a start-up founder’s perspective
You’re a twit.
Very ballsy, I like!
Michael, You are the Man!
Unfortunately I guess I won’t be able to participate TC50 ever in my life ;( stuck in India you know…
Will there be a TC50 India soon?
I’d like to think this is a joke, but it may not be.
“Go read Techcrunch NOW. Oh my god Arrington, you have HUGE FUCKING BALLS” – Friendfeed post.
” Free to launch, 2,000 attendees, $50,000 cash prize to winner. $4 million in free advertising. Awesomeness in a bottle.” Thumbs up!
Demo, $20,000 to launch? Thumbs down…
These bake-offs would just be better if someone found Chuck Baris’s old gong from the gong show. Think about it Michael…oh, that bit of advice was free.
great idea actually.
lol
Ha, very cool – you can rest assured we’ll get another post up. I still don’t quite get why you can’t just be satisfied with your individual niches.
I just wanted to say Matt Marshall is a greedy punk-ass who needs to enroll in Michael Arrington 101. Actually, he needs Remedial Arrington for Dummies.
Mike- It’d be nice to see what “$4mm” or even “$2mm” in advertising is — is the CPM like $20 on the TC network and IDG? How long will it take to get the $4mm in advertising — 4 years? I wouldn’t think either of you are going to give up the super valuable above-the-fold inventories. -yours truly, devil’s advocate
That is sort of my point, it’s all a shell game. That’s why we focused on a cash prize, you can’t argue with that.
That’s the point of this story.
Perhaps making it even clearer what you really get in terms of advertising on TC network would add to your offers credibility. It still seems a bit ambiguous to me – we’ll give you 4 mill in ads … but it’s a shell game! If it isn’t exactly clear what DEMO are offering then you should ensure that it IS exactly clear what you are offering.
Just an idea.
You should keep like 2 open spots until the week before TC50, in case some startups are really super stealthy. Plus, even if there were like 5-10 startups that weren’t chosen in the final 48, but were being considered for the final 2 spots [or 5], I’m sure they’ll figure out a way to get get to TC50.
Mike, anyway you can keep this year’s entrants up to speed with how you are progressing with your selection process?
From our point of view, it would be nice if the process was as transparent as possible. Maybe an updated TC50 blog?
PS $20,000 to launch a startup is a joke. Think the best startups can put that money to far better use. I know I could.
I love Techcrunch, you guys kick DEMO’s ASS
this is great stuff, will DEMO even let your writers attend their event now and if so would you even want to send them?
Did you get our application?
Just Kiddin, divorce was mentioned
great move Mike
pay to play sucks
TC50 Rocks
tc50 Alumni 07
Mike-
Please correct me if I am wrong- but was this an emotional decision? Your idea of crushing your enemy at first blush comes off as brilliant. But what will Techcrunch and partners do if Demo continues to raise the offer while deploying similar moves (ie with partners?).
TC is certainly the better brand– but like all advertising mediums has to have a finite amount of ad inventory.
If the numbers become silly– would that not adversely affect the quality of the techcrunch offering if the number of free ads out number those that are paid?
I am here to stay… love you guys… and looking for you to win. Why not open it up to those of us who are loyal and willing to walk through the fire for the knowledge TC provides us daily?
Use your community to offset the effects that could be negative to TC… Maybe post to see how we can help–
Warmest.
JB.
If IDG was smart they’d increase the prize to 100MM$ as a response
I’m offering $1 billion in free advertising on Scripting News to any startup who skips both shows. And I’ll up it to $1 trillion in free advertising if Mike says “Dave is my hero” in response to this comment.
Dave is my hero
lol
Dave [used to be] my hero.
Does that mean you’re going to unfollow Dave on Twitter? Who’s next? @ScobIeizer? What is the world coming to? First Leo, then the destruction of the Gillmor gang, now Dave? OMG get me a beer!
Mike, thanks for taking a stand against the pay-to-play capital raising schemes and other so-called forums that suck the energy and $’s from start-ups.
Damn dude…you just done bitch slapped a floozy.
Is there any rule that says a startup must choose? Can’t they attend both events?
I was in the demo pit at last years TC50 and I’ll tell you why it destroyed demo. Some people still don’t understand that paying to get your name out there does not equal credibility or success. People care about great products and those usually don’t come from companies with piles of cash lying around. Sure you could debate about whether or not the 50 that actually get picked are the “best of the best” but believe me, they all went through a very long grueling process to get one of those 50 spots and the honest attempt was to get the best. I went through at least 3 interviews myself so I know that the effort was there. People just want to see great products and that’s what TC50 is focused on and that’s why people show up.
P.S. If you don’t get picked to be in the top 50 you should still participate in the demopit as it was well worth it.
Interesting… in what way was demo pit worth it? What did you gain from it?
I did not hear to many good things about it (i. e. waste of money…)
Well it depends on what you are hoping to get out of it. If you go and think your going to get that last 50th place on stage and it’s going to make you an overnight success then you will probably be disappointed but that’s the wrong attitude to have anyways because that just doesn’t happen. You get to stand there all day while a constant stream of people come and you get to show off your product to tons of members from the press, potential investors, and other potential business partners.
If you have something that is impressive to show off and isn’t very hard to explain you can really get a lot out of it. Just don’t stress out about the tokens because someone will always game that system anyways.
Oh no he didn’t! ..
what is DEMO ? haha, jk
DEMO is the hot lunch of the conference circuit.
for more information on hot lunch, please see http://www.urba...?term=hot+lunch
I agree, the advertising is bunk. So is having to pay 20K to demo. However I will say that a $50k prize from TC to 1 company is kinda bunk too. I don’t know exactly what it costs to put on the TC50 but you guys are pulling in quite a bit. 2000 attendees x $2000+ per ticket = $4 million! And thats before the 600k or so from the 200 companies in the pit and the who knows how much in advertising/sponsors. Don’t get me wrong, I think what you guys are doing is great for startups but if you guys are pocketing millions and giving away 50k it looks like your doing it for the money and not the companies.
we’re doing it…for the children.
+1 – there’s no reason to charge the demo pit companies when they charge $2k a ticket to the event.
They can’t continue to say they don’t charge companies to demo when 75% of them are being charged $3k.
you sure do seem to know a lot about conference economics.
nope. I’m not anyone from DEMO. I’m actually a long time TC reader who attended TC50 and was astonished at who won and how much you were charging the demo pit startups.
oh, no. I was being sarcastic. as in, you don’t have any idea about conference economics.
Does the TechCrunch50 prize include help with development of the creative content for the advertising campaign?
Advertising space without great ads would be a bit of a mismatch.
who knows. we’ll figure it out later.
Really?
Come on Mike – it’s a bit lame to poke fun at DEMO and their efforts when you make an offer to the community and follow up with comments like this – isn’t it? A bit like the pot calling the kettle black?
You really should think about the terms of your offer before announcing it.
Mike, my company, Qoof.com is happy to offer 10,000,000 impressions (5 mil & 5 mil) for the two top winners using our video commerce platform. We will cover all the costs involved and wave all fees. The winners just need to supply us with a video up to 7 minutes long and we will work to customize the “call to actions” adding in their logo, color scheme, pdf’s, forms or whatever. Shoot me an email if interested and will give the rest of the details. You can see a sample of the widget on the home page of Behind the burner: http://www.behi...dtheburner.com/
How about pre-empting DEMO’s next move and double your prize money? Or get your major sponsors to pony up the money for a $1,000,000 prize for first place? Now THAT would get people’s attention.
have people completely forgotten that the next google, microsoft, ibm, hp, etc will not be at demo or techcrunch? that ain’t how innovation works, these conferences are just part of a larger wealth transfer game for the same (circa) 50 venture partners, period.
Now I like this.
I love the smell of competition in the morning.
All this 2million rumor, started because of Allen Stern of CenterNetworks is one POS and he hates on all other blogs that do a better job of delivering news and have better contents than his retarded looking site. He is always hating on TC, Mahalo and everything associated with TC50 on twitter.
He should just quite blogging and go lose some weight. Fat fuk!
Its hard to beat TC’s offer now! Demo would be closed down soon!
I can’t stop smiling after reading this article.
Mike, you have outdone yourself…in more ways than one.
Can’t wait to show off our startup at TechCrunch50
ourblock.tv – nice concept…..you will have a captive audience at http://www.development.tv!!
good luck with the prioject
1. DEMO is around for at least 15+ years.
2. They used to be very hard to get into, invitation only. Has this changed?
3. My previous startup was acquired because we were at DEMO so it clearly works.
4. $20K is a barrier – a smart strategy. If you got something real and viable – $20K is nothing. If you got bull – save your $$ and get a job.
Ugh. This is childish. I’ve read tech crunch for a couple years and am sad to see this sort of fraternity style dick-swinging arrogance and Jerry Springer smut is pretty piss-poor. My respect for TC is notched down a few steps with crap like this. CRAP.
I think Techcrunch should have just made the headline “DEMO’s 2 million in ad inventory is Bullshit,” gotten a shitload of links, and called it a day.
That would have been a more amusing and more honest approach then getting into some bullshit game about who’s giving away more bullshit ad inventory. Where will it end? DEMO will say, “Fine, since this 2 million in ad inventory is bullshit anyway, we’ll gave 10 million.” So, Techrunch will double that.
And on and on, until both conferences are giving away a combined 100 million in fake ad inventory.
Don’t play these stupid games with DEMO, Mike. Just call like it is; say it’s bullshit. People will enjoy that much more…
The price for these events is overrated. Name it DEMO, TC50 or whatever. I’m talking about the ticket price. Want to make a bold move? Forget the $4M in ads showoff and reduce the ticket price by 1/2.
i love these battles. TC50 always wins.
Mike, great job and thank you. Your focus on startups first is what encouraged me to apply to TC50 only.
Your generosity to entrepreneurs is very much appreciated.
Mike, keep up great work!
I swear Mr.. A you need a smack off page where you and CEO’s can do blog style MMA… and we can vote on the winners….
MMA mixed martial arts.. I think.. but for tech nerds
Genius!!!
I think the real difference will be the TC50 rumored edition of keyboard cat playing off startups that dont pass the muster.
And addition too.