I’m sorry, but for as good as Google is at organizing the world’s data, Google News absolutely sucks. Now, to be fair, I’m going to focus on Google News from a tech news perspective, because that’s what I follow. Maybe it’s better in other areas, but I doubt it’s much better. I bring this up because a new update to the service today promised “More ways to see the story.” Okay, that’s true, as long as you don’t mind seeing stories that range from partially unrelated to entirely unrelated.
Now, when you click on the “all XXXX news articles” link below each story cluster in Google News, you are taken to a page with a range of content. This includes not only major publication headlines, but blog headlines, picture thumbnails, a timeline of articles on the topic, and even quotes about the topic. The problem, as you can see in my screenshots below, is that Google cannot seem to cluster stories together correctly.
If it sees a story is about say, a religious app being banned on the iPhone, it will cluster that with a story about iPhone ad data — even though the two are not the same story at all. Yet when you click to go to the new area, it indicates that they are the same story, as you can do things like “Search the story.” On any given day there are probably a dozen different stories about the iPhone (at least), and I guess it’d be fine (but silly) if Google wants to cluster them all together. But it doesn’t even do that. There are several clusters containing iPhone items. It seems to be just random which ones go where.
The problem is that Google uses an algorithm to do this clustering. As the vastly superior news aggregator Techmeme, learned quite a while ago, there needs to be some human curation involved. While an algorithm may not be able to see the difference in iPhone stories (or Microsoft stories, or anything else in my example below for that matter), a human could.
Further, the biggest problem with Google News when it comes to tech news is that many of the items that appear are laughably old. It’s fine if you want to say it’s for the masses to get a better overview of what’s going on, but at least indicate that these topics aren’t breaking items just because some site decided to write about it again a day or two days or a week after someone else published the story first.
The timeline view kind of indicates the age of a story, but if you see it’s far from its peak, then don’t make it a top item on Google News. Almost all of the top items right now are far from their peaks.
I could go on. Many of the headlines Google News chooses to use are complete nonsense and give readers absolutely no idea what a story is about. And the excerpts below the titles are often a gibberish mixture of author names, cities the story is based in and random links that don’t appear as links in the excerpts — giving you excepts like, “By Austin Modine Get more from this author Facebook has once again.” Brilliant.
[photo: flickr/ang (3girls)]
You can’t assume that the problem is that they use an algorithm. You could have made the same argument about search engine relevance by looking at Yahoo or Altavista in 1998, or spam classification before decent probabilistic filters came into the scene.
The problem is that the algorithm they are using is not good enough. I have no doubt that Google could do better at this if they cared. The question is how much R&D they are willing to spend on Google News right now.
fair enough. but the company known for its algorithms you’d think would have a better algorithm here.
i think all those features were already there…
Google’s algorithms are based on the activities and clicks of users. So there absolutely is a lot of so called “human curation” involved.
Google News is much more than just displaying an overview of the most important general stories on general topics.
Google News provides the worlds best news search, real-time news alerts, real-time news RSS feeds.
Anything that happens, just search it on Google News, it’s the best way to find good news articles.
Sure Google needs to do much better recommendations of news items, it should be also personalized to each user. Just as Google needs to recommend blog items in Google Reader also based on stars that people give items.
I load this as one of my default tabs each time that I open Chrome: http://blogsear...=en&topic=t together with Techmeme it gives some nice overview of some of the big actual tech stories.
Charbax is right on, you seem to be concentrating on the top stories page and completely ignoring search. No surprise it rocks at searching news. Where else can you go to search 25,000 publications? I just searched for “Facebook Payment” and sure enough the article from Techcrunch posted 12 hours ago showed up.
That’s why I love TechFuga among all Aggregators yep even your guy’s favorite Techmeme
And Mr. Siegler you are correct by saying that google news do suck. Well not suck but they just seems not to put much thoughts into that.
Now imagine this!
true?
Wouldn’t it be cool if RSS feeds would be like Aggregators? To combine all news together if you are subscribed to let say 100 tech blogs? I mean eventually we all write same BS
You’re aware of this, right?
“The question is how much R&D they are willing to spend on Google News right now.”
I’d say very little. Even though some news agencies are successfully making the shift to the online realm, there are many others that are not. Traditional media is somewhat in limbo, excluding the very top few. This fact brings some interesting things to mind for Google, I’m sure. Concerning some of the top online news agencies now, I think Google knows that most users would directly go to the websites for the NYT, CNN, BBC, FOX, and MSNBC and others, rather than visiting Google News. I think you can tell that Google is struggling to decide on how to work with that fact.
I imagine more effort and money will be put into Google News when news broadcasting stabilizes somewhat. Although, with things like Twitter and (some) citizen journalism beginning to take a real root, perhaps Google will focus more on that eventually, as more competition to the leaders than aggregation of them.
I think the way Google News is being developed isn’t a sign that Google’s doing a poor job. (It’s average, at least.) I think it’s a sign that Google is still deciding on where to go with its development, on the whole.
I think Google must have prototypes of an engine which can basically generate short stories about the news. The problem is that if Google releases it, they would get sued even more by newspapers.
Diego said…
The problem is that the algorithm they are using is not good enough.
I agree. There are many different clustering algorithms available today and we don’t know if the classification error of their algorithms are worst than others or not, but I am surprised that their R&D guys are not into it to develop something superior, either by developing their own or implement one of the many recent superior ones that are already available in the literatures.
Agreed. Google does very little in this space. Google Reader does a better job of suggestions IMO.
Google Reader doesn’t suggest items, it only suggests feeds based on your subscribed feeds.
Seems like their algorithm isn’t quite accurate yet. Probably just doing searches based on keywords from automation. I’m sure they’ll implement a human of some sort eventually.
What are they getting into news for now? Competing against everybody on TC/Techmeme?!
Google reader is depend on Algorithm not giving the accurate data which we need.
still google is failing
autos: quick fix fail
http://www.epic.../load/8-1-0-345
Editors are human for now until AI is evolved. What better application of AI than fixing Google News!
Besides, by the time that happens, all news sources will have been combined, refined, and digested down to three websites. As such, this problem becomes much simpler to solve…. oh wait.
For truly industrial grade useless, the blog search is a sure bet for gamed result sets. So, if news becomes more bloggy… yeah.
Why doesn’t Google finance offer level 2-3 quotes?
Where are the candle sticks?
I am officially complaining right now.
Why isn’t there Google trends for tickers. That would be the single most powerful force in the market beyond even Warren Buffet.
I think Google isn’t doing trends for tickers on purpose because they are afraid of the FTC.
I think Google is scared to even though it would be legitimate.
MG, another great headline and post. Reading this from Rio de Janeiro (usually from bay area).
Techrunch needs to have a “conference” here. Unbelievable locale!
thanks for the update on your location, we were getting worried.
I agree unfortunately, all that Google news is good for is driving the odd traffic from the search page for when you get a press-release indexed.
I would like to like Google News, or Google Readers, Or iGoogle, but as much as I would; I cant!
Daniel
https://spideroak.com – Online Backup and Sync
I would like to see MG Seigler write a post about what Google finance is and what it could be.
There aren’t so much as earnings estimates on there where there are on Yahoo and Reuters.
The ONLY thing that keeps Google Finance alive is the groups. The Ajax charts are better than Yahoo, MSN, ect… but there are no candlesticks, no projection tools, nothing.
Google Finance for Android also is incomplete.
Doesn’t this company have billions of dollars?
Throw a developer or two on that project for god’s sake.
It’s about as evolved as Google search was back in 1996.
If they add some of this stuff, they should also add real time quotes from the same tickers from the Nikkei and also a cross reference between the same tickers on foreign markets and US markets.
That’s what people want. Google is too slow to get it to them. BTW, my resume is in the Santa Monica office, and I am still on Cali work share. I’d do it.
Dang, I like google’s news. I’ll check out techmeme. If they can perfect the automation on they will kill ALL.
Human curation does not scale. This is a content law proven over and over.
Google News still have a long road to achieve what we all want. Of course Google Reader does a better job, because we feed it.
I still find Google News useful, but it definitely requires sorting through the garbage
I’m not totally convinced, but yes Google doesn’t generate any content on its own (unlike its rivals) but still manages to bring the whole lot of news on a single page. And i’m quiet sure, that their constant tweaking will only push relevancy scale up!
I think that Google make money on his customers or bloggers back. My AdSense account has been closed without any clear motivation. At the closing moment I must to receive $169,16. SUCKS!
They are trying to make it better, but everyone has long way to go. All the news websites are really not that good in terms of providing good and comprehensive news. The latest change i saw was pretty bad and confusing.
MG,
Hey I was just playing Gears of War 2 online and there’s someone with your name as their player name. Is that you? If so, did you just start playing recently?
Sadly no, it wasn’t me. What was the name?
I’m pretty sure it just said MGSiegler.
Or maybe MG Siegler (with a space. Well you’re better off it not being you, they were really horrible.
Do you play GOW?
I don’t think your criticism of Google news is justified.
Firstly, Google *can’t* get into the realm of human editors, because at that point it becomes a content creator with the potential for political bias. As long as it relies entirely on an algorithm, it can rise above accusations like that, just like ti tries to for web search.
Google isn’t writing the headlines, so you can hardly blame them for that! I imagine it’s picking the headline for the “cluster” based on an authority ranking, not the writer’s grasp of the English language.
The same goes for your “Windows 7 is not Office” comment. Blame the human working for the news publication that thinks it is, not Google.
And as for those unrelated iphone stories… well, it’s likely that a set of stories about the iPhone in major news publications on any given day *will* feature the same key points, even if the headlines concentrate on different aspects. You probably need to click through and read the entire articles.
But you should also remember, that 90% of the news-reading public is not that tech-savvy and would absolutely expect all iPhone stories on a given day to be grouped together…. the fact that they will all be slightly different is precisely WHY you are given the option of searching within the story.
I don’t think your criticism of Google news is justified.
Firstly, Google *can’t* get into the realm of human editors, because at that point it becomes a content creator with the potential for political bias. As long as it relies entirely on an algorithm, it can rise above accusations like that, just like ti tries to for web search.
Google isn’t writing the headlines, so you can hardly blame them for that! I imagine it’s picking the headline for the “cluster” based on an authority ranking, not the writer’s grasp of the English language.
The same goes for your “Windows 7 is not Office” comment. Blame the human working for the news publication that thinks it is, not Google.
And as for those unrelated iphone stories… well, it’s likely that a set of stories about the iPhone in major news publications on any given day *will* feature the same key points, even if the headlines concentrate on different aspects. You probably need to click through and read the entire articles.
But you should also remember, that 90% of the news-reading public is not that tech-savvy and would absolutely expect all iPhone stories on a given day to be grouped together…. the fact that they will all be slightly different is precisely WHY you are given the option of searching within the story.
Sorry… forgot to say great post – can’t wait to read your next one!
Er… Techchrunch?
Why is someone else re-posting in my name immediately after me, but changing my comments?
Please remove this!
Agreed.. Google News Sci/Tech needs improvement.. But by picking two examples that really make Google News look bad you are guilty of yellow journalism.. Let me explain…
You created two examples to fit your theory and make your point. In my experience Google News gets it right a hell of a lot more times than it gets it wrong. You decided to take two exceptions to the rule and paint Google News with a broad brush saying it always gets it wrong. That is simply not the case.
Lastly I think you’re a bit mad at Google News because it doesn’t more prominently feature Tech Crunch content.
I suggest you go hide under a rock for three months like your boss did. Need a pacifier to go with your Wa wa wa ?
GOogle should have better look at Gogole news now.
Google is good at two things: Search and Ad Serving. That’s it.
exactly!
… and email, maps, feed reading, etc. What are you talking about…
jackbills3 -
it’s called shopping for facts to fit your hypothesis instead of taking an objective look at the facts and then coming to a conclusion.
I get your point.. I agree about 75 percent.
Google is having a rough couple of weeks. We heard negative news of Google being hit with two possible antitrust inquiries from book settlement with publishers and membership between its board and Apple’s. Now its criticism on Google news and then Wolfram Alpha what people have tagged “The Google Killer”. Lets hope they have a better week.
lol.
Stupid google. Not having every single application they ever make not 100% perfect to everyone. WHO DO THEY THINK THEY ARE? If only Steve Jobs could make some awesome search engine – right Siegler? You’d even PAY for that, wouldn’t you?
lmao.
Surprise surprise that techcrunch praises techmeme to the sky, since every day their top articles appear there! And anyway, I doubt techmeme was ever machine-only, they just fessed up to that later. At least Goog news doesn’t include weather in Tulsa stories, the way they used to!
You’re probably the less tech savvy blogger in the world!, read your article about Google Reader (LAME!!!) read your article about Google News (LAME!!!) and I mean, it seems like you don’t know what a news feed is? I mean, do you really think its Google’s fault that the feeds are malformed?
BTW, try Googling a Tweet and you’ll see what really sucks is the sites not implementing good SEO techniques or bad news feeds.
Why dont you talk to the creator. Then shit your pants at how you dont understand how it works.
MG thanks for this posting and others. Your input makes sense and your criticisms. Keep it coming. I’m also trying to build some kind of news website, so I have been reading a lot about news and how to distribute news specifically. I personally think Google News is pretty weak and totally disorganized.
Well – isn’t this a reason why sites like techcrunch and techmeme exist?
funny picture
I tried a Google News-feed widget thingy on my blog about adult learning. I set the search topic (or something, however that’s done) and waited for it to provide an interesting, up-to-date look at some literacy related news stories.
Instead, it offered as the lead story a letter to the editor of a newspaper about how adults learning to read should be barred from libraries because they are too noisy.
Well… I guess that’s news, sort of.
Of course I dumped the whole thing.
check out http://www.opedblogs.com connecting news and good quality blogs
I use GN for my job aggregating what is much more traditional news, and it actually does quite well.
I’m very limited in what I can reprint, and they typically do a good job of showing me all available stories on a subject so I can find a compatible source.
I do sometimes try to find other types of news, trade related, and agree it’s much tougher to find. There also seems to be a couple of bad apples that infiltrate the listings, getting quite a bit of their editorial content up from blog formats, which based on my understanding isn’t suppose to be allowed.
Google news is riding on its brand name … I tried using it for a while but the search results are very noisy… there’s too much information withour proper filtering…
http://www.noodls.com exactly answers this porblem… more coverage (19000+ sources across the globe) & very high level of segmented content…
Google News is without perspective…but with control the mind objective