Comments on: What’s In A Name? Trusty’s Sued By Angie’s List Over Data Theft http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/ Startup and Technology News Thu, 26 Nov 2009 18:33:15 -0800 hourly 1 By: J.W. http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2597305 J.W. Sun, 18 Jan 2009 08:11:39 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2597305 Angies List Subscription $7, Off-Shored Angies List Scraper Bot $500, Getting Sued by Angies List $$Priceless$$. http://www.bighardhat.org Angies List Subscription $7, Off-Shored Angies List Scraper Bot $500, Getting Sued by Angies List $$Priceless$$.

http://www.bighardhat.org

]]> By: Andy http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2594748 Andy Thu, 15 Jan 2009 15:39:36 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2594748 Hmm here is the Angies List TOS, http://www.angieslist.com/Angieslist/ALUserAgreement.aspx They write: "You acknowledge and agree that You will not access, reproduce, duplicate, copy, sell, re-sell, visit or otherwise exploit for any commercial, educational (or any other non-personal) purpose the reviews and ratings and any content, without the express written consent of Angie's List" BUT, they also dont claim ownership of the actual reviews, so it may be the type of thing where the "copyright" value is in AngiesList's collection as a whole, so as long as Trusty's collection is at least a little different than angies list, they might be okay. Christopher Kody's account, on the other hand, is probably toast. Hmm here is the Angies List TOS, http://www.angi...rAgreement.aspx

They write: “You acknowledge and agree that You will not access, reproduce, duplicate, copy, sell, re-sell, visit or otherwise exploit for any commercial, educational (or any other non-personal) purpose the reviews and ratings and any content, without the express written consent of Angie’s List”

BUT, they also dont claim ownership of the actual reviews, so it may be the type of thing where the “copyright” value is in AngiesList’s collection as a whole, so as long as Trusty’s collection is at least a little different than angies list, they might be okay.

Christopher Kody’s account, on the other hand, is probably toast.

]]> By: passingby http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2594703 passingby Thu, 15 Jan 2009 14:35:41 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2594703 It is interesting that Angie’s List is developing a pretty solid bad reputation around, look at the comments at the original article and the links Derek pointed to. Even if Trustys gets crushed by this lawsuit, this market is still wide open for new competitors to jump in. It is interesting that Angie’s List is developing a pretty solid bad reputation around, look at the comments at the original article and the links Derek pointed to. Even if Trustys gets crushed by this lawsuit, this market is still wide open for new competitors to jump in.

]]> By: Angie’s List Sues Trusty’s http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2594617 Angie’s List Sues Trusty’s Thu, 15 Jan 2009 11:40:11 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2594617 [...] Robin Wauters, “What’s In A Name? Trusty’s Sued By Angie’s List Over Data Theft,” TechCrun... Share and [...] [...] Robin Wauters, “What’s In A Name? Trusty’s Sued By Angie’s List Over Data Theft,” TechCrun… Share and [...]

]]> By: mike http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2594394 mike Thu, 15 Jan 2009 05:22:51 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2594394 LOL, Hey angieslist u dummies folks! You just gave "Trusty’s" free advertisement to your competitor hehe! !! LOL, Hey angieslist u dummies folks! You just gave “Trusty’s” free advertisement to your competitor hehe! !!

]]> By: Just http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2594097 Just Wed, 14 Jan 2009 23:16:15 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2594097 Another suit dealing with listings (not ratings and reviews) that was lost. http://guidingrights.blogcollective.com/blog/_archives/2005/9/27/1254630.html Another suit dealing with listings (not ratings and reviews) that was lost.

http://guidingr...27/1254630.html

]]> By: Derek http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2594038 Derek Wed, 14 Jan 2009 22:19:53 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2594038 Who are you kidding! There are many service professionals out there who claimed they were bullied into advertising on Angie's List. TechCrunch readers can find out the truth by reading: http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/0/364/RipOff0364982.htm http://www.houseblogs.net/community/comments.php?DiscussionID=139 http://knaddison.com/technology/why-angies-list-sucks Who are you kidding! There are many service professionals out there who claimed they were bullied into advertising on Angie’s List. TechCrunch readers can find out the truth by reading:

http://www.ripo...pOff0364982.htm

http://www.hous...iscussionID=139

http://knaddiso...gies-list-sucks

]]> By: Cheryl from Angie's List http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2593983 Cheryl from Angie's List Wed, 14 Jan 2009 21:44:34 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2593983 Angie’s List absolutely does not delete negative reports without justification and notification to the member who posted the report. The advertising status of a service company isn’t a factor. We delete reports only when they’ve been submitted in violation of our policies. If you’d like to talk about this, Derek, please feel free to contact me directly at cherylr@angieslist.com Angie’s List absolutely does not delete negative reports without justification and notification to the member who posted the report. The advertising status of a service company isn’t a factor. We delete reports only when they’ve been submitted in violation of our policies. If you’d like to talk about this, Derek, please feel free to contact me directly at cherylr@angieslist.com

]]> By: Ryan http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2593950 Ryan Wed, 14 Jan 2009 21:02:29 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2593950 A quick visit to my blog would show that I don't work for Angie's List. Nice try though. I'm just a happy subscriber. Also, I like any business that puts as much money into restoring deteriorating parts of downtown Indianapolis as Angie's List has. They are a VERY popular company in this city, which is where they are based. A quick visit to my blog would show that I don’t work for Angie’s List. Nice try though. I’m just a happy subscriber. Also, I like any business that puts as much money into restoring deteriorating parts of downtown Indianapolis as Angie’s List has. They are a VERY popular company in this city, which is where they are based.

]]> By: RainRacer http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2593898 RainRacer Wed, 14 Jan 2009 19:52:00 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2593898 That's why I use Consumers' CHECKBOOK (no adverising, nonprofit, been around a long time, www.checkbook.org) but I don't think they're available in very many cities. That’s why I use Consumers’ CHECKBOOK (no adverising, nonprofit, been around a long time, http://www.checkbook.org) but I don’t think they’re available in very many cities.

]]> By: ブルーカラー向け地域情報サービスのTrusty’s、Angie’s Listからデータ盗用で訴えられる http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2593896 ブルーカラー向け地域情報サービスのTrusty’s、Angie’s Listからデータ盗用で訴えられる Wed, 14 Jan 2009 19:50:36 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2593896 [...] InformationAngie’s ListTrusty’sInformation provided by CrunchBase[原文へ]（翻訳：Namekawa, U） ShowListings("arc3"); ShowListings("arc2"); AddClipsUrl = [...] [...] InformationAngie’s ListTrusty’sInformation provided by CrunchBase[原文へ]（翻訳：Namekawa, U） ShowListings(”arc3″); ShowListings(”arc2″); AddClipsUrl = [...]

]]> By: EH http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2593825 EH Wed, 14 Jan 2009 18:42:50 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2593825 I'll tell you how: "guilt" is a concept used only in criminal cases. I’ll tell you how: “guilt” is a concept used only in criminal cases.

]]> By: EH http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2593824 EH Wed, 14 Jan 2009 18:40:06 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2593824 Smuckers routinely tops the lists of best places to work, yet their jams, jellies and marmalades are not the best. How could that be? Smuckers routinely tops the lists of best places to work, yet their jams, jellies and marmalades are not the best. How could that be?

]]> By: Amy http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2593803 Amy Wed, 14 Jan 2009 18:06:07 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2593803 Did you actually use the companies? Angie's List *will* remove a report if you can't prove you used the company. It's how they keep competing companies from putting out a ton of negative reviews against each other. Did you actually use the companies?
Angie’s List *will* remove a report if you can’t prove you used the company. It’s how they keep competing companies from putting out a ton of negative reviews against each other.

]]> By: jsdev http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2593748 jsdev Wed, 14 Jan 2009 17:12:57 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2593748 I wonder what Trusty's was thinking, and this sounds nothing like an aggregator unless they stole from a bunch of sites and not just a 66million dollar startup. simplyhired.com which i don't know how is legal steals (er.. aggregates) all the job listings from as many job sites as they can) I guess no one sues them as they link to the respective site where people apply to the job on monster.com or yahoo hot jobs. so sounds like Trusty's not only riding the coattails of another startup but the real rub is they don't link to them and credit them. i don't see how trusty's is not found guilty. I wonder what Trusty’s was thinking, and this sounds nothing like an aggregator unless they stole from a bunch of sites and not just a 66million dollar startup.

simplyhired.com which i don’t know how is legal steals (er.. aggregates) all the job listings from as many job sites as they can) I guess no one sues them as they link to the respective site where people apply to the job on monster.com or yahoo hot jobs.

so sounds like Trusty’s not only riding the coattails of another startup but the real rub is they don’t link to them and credit them. i don’t see how trusty’s is not found guilty.

]]> By: Ben http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2593745 Ben Wed, 14 Jan 2009 17:06:43 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2593745 The legal issues related to snippeting and linking back to content are complicated and very important to how the web works. It would be great to see some of that laid out for the techcrunch community. However, logging it a closed site and abusing the terms of service is a clear no no and will create significant issues for the defendent. Angie's list sells access to its proprietary content, it does not let it be seen openly. Logging in and taking it is like logging into a paid financial data site and taking thier information and putting it out on the web. As for Angie's list being bottom of the barrel, I see them providing a valuable service to a bunch of consumers who pay for it with a subscription. I actually have not used them, I have used ServiceMagic instead but if you have ever had to find a person to fix that electrical outlet that does not work---these guys are a lifesaver The legal issues related to snippeting and linking back to content are complicated and very important to how the web works. It would be great to see some of that laid out for the techcrunch community.

However, logging it a closed site and abusing the terms of service is a clear no no and will create significant issues for the defendent.

Angie’s list sells access to its proprietary content, it does not let it be seen openly. Logging in and taking it is like logging into a paid financial data site and taking thier information and putting it out on the web.

As for Angie’s list being bottom of the barrel, I see them providing a valuable service to a bunch of consumers who pay for it with a subscription. I actually have not used them, I have used ServiceMagic instead but if you have ever had to find a person to fix that electrical outlet that does not work—these guys are a lifesaver

]]> By: Derek http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2593744 Derek Wed, 14 Jan 2009 17:05:30 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2593744 A few months ago I did a test to see which websites would remove scathing comments regarding their paying advertisers. I submitted reviews to all the major review sites as well as the various yellow page sites. Yelp, Citysearch and Angies List were all serious offenders. While they did not necessarily remove the negative reviews right away, over a period of several months all three sites removed them with no explanation. Citysearch was the worst, having removed the negative review less than a week after the local business became an advertiser and refused to respond to numerous emails inquiring as to why the review was deleted. It is a well known fact, verified by many former Angies List employees that the site is highly manipulated. Deny it all you want, with membership tanking we can all expect that Angies List will become even more desperate and contrived. A few months ago I did a test to see which websites would remove scathing comments regarding their paying advertisers. I submitted reviews to all the major review sites as well as the various yellow page sites.

Yelp, Citysearch and Angies List were all serious offenders. While they did not necessarily remove the negative reviews right away, over a period of several months all three sites removed them with no explanation. Citysearch was the worst, having removed the negative review less than a week after the local business became an advertiser and refused to respond to numerous emails inquiring as to why the review was deleted.

It is a well known fact, verified by many former Angies List employees that the site is highly manipulated. Deny it all you want, with membership tanking we can all expect that Angies List will become even more desperate and contrived.

]]> By: Server Protection http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2593719 Server Protection Wed, 14 Jan 2009 16:25:45 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2593719 This is shady business to say the least. This is shady business to say the least.

]]> By: Mike http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2593711 Mike Wed, 14 Jan 2009 16:09:49 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2593711 I don't think that the problem here is with page scraping itself. Where these guys went wrong is logging into Angie's List to do the scrape (almost certainly in violation of the ToS). If the data is publically available I don't think there is much you can do to stop a scrapper (at least legally). Other cases like Ebay v. Bidder's Edge have all won against scrapers by other means, in the Ebay case it was because Bidder's Edge was using an enormous amount of their bandwidth. I don’t think that the problem here is with page scraping itself. Where these guys went wrong is logging into Angie’s List to do the scrape (almost certainly in violation of the ToS). If the data is publically available I don’t think there is much you can do to stop a scrapper (at least legally). Other cases like Ebay v. Bidder’s Edge have all won against scrapers by other means, in the Ebay case it was because Bidder’s Edge was using an enormous amount of their bandwidth.

]]> By: Alex http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2593687 Alex Wed, 14 Jan 2009 15:46:10 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2593687 Looks like Angie's list employees are out in force today Looks like Angie’s list employees are out in force today

]]> By: Joe http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2593686 Joe Wed, 14 Jan 2009 15:45:34 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2593686 Derek - January 14th, 2009 at 5:52 am PST Angie’s List is itself a fraud because it removes poor ratings for businesses who advertise. And you know this how? Angie's List actually revokes the advertising privileges of advertisers who don't maintain at least a "B" rating and they don't remove any reports unless they cannot be verified. Check your facts before you spew inaccuracies just for the sake of stirring the pot. Derek – January 14th, 2009 at 5:52 am PST
Angie’s List is itself a fraud because it removes poor ratings for businesses who advertise.

And you know this how?

Angie’s List actually revokes the advertising privileges of advertisers who don’t maintain at least a “B” rating and they don’t remove any reports unless they cannot be verified. Check your facts before you spew inaccuracies just for the sake of stirring the pot.

]]> By: Gary http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2593682 Gary Wed, 14 Jan 2009 15:43:52 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2593682 That's a really silly comparison. That’s a really silly comparison.

]]> By: LawsuitLocator.com http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2593672 LawsuitLocator.com Wed, 14 Jan 2009 15:34:44 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2593672 where do search engines get there content? o.p.w. other peoples websites. JudgeLocator.com - justice served where do search engines get there content? o.p.w. other peoples websites.

JudgeLocator.com – justice served

]]> By: Ryan http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2593666 Ryan Wed, 14 Jan 2009 15:26:29 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2593666 Really? Angie's List is bottom of the barrel? The consistently make the list of one of the best places to work in Indiana. Their customers love them, and they provide a valuable service (advice on which plumbers, electricians, etc. are trustworthy). If their members complain about a company, that company is not allowed on the list, paid advertiser or not, from what I understand. By the way, the Indianapolis Star is a daily newspaper owned by Gannett, not a magazine. They're the largest paper in the state and one of the larger papers in the country. Really? Angie’s List is bottom of the barrel? The consistently make the list of one of the best places to work in Indiana. Their customers love them, and they provide a valuable service (advice on which plumbers, electricians, etc. are trustworthy). If their members complain about a company, that company is not allowed on the list, paid advertiser or not, from what I understand.

By the way, the Indianapolis Star is a daily newspaper owned by Gannett, not a magazine. They’re the largest paper in the state and one of the larger papers in the country.

]]> By: ExtraMedium http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/01/14/whats-in-a-name-trustys-sued-by-angies-list-over-data-theft/comment-page-1/#comment-2593652 ExtraMedium Wed, 14 Jan 2009 15:11:43 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=37620#comment-2593652 I don't think the issue is that he used a page scraping tool, it's that he's posting their info as his own. It would be the same if he sat there and copied it by hand and plugged it in to his site. I don’t think the issue is that he used a page scraping tool, it’s that he’s posting their info as his own. It would be the same if he sat there and copied it by hand and plugged it in to his site.

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