Comments on: Sun Preps RIA Resurgence With New Java Release http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/ Startup and Technology News Thu, 26 Nov 2009 18:13:08 -0800 hourly 1 By: Richard Jahmarkt http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2640848 Richard Jahmarkt Mon, 02 Mar 2009 10:39:03 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2640848 It's obviously important to keep RIA market penetration in mind. Looks like java is picking up support though: http://www.statowl.com/java.php It’s obviously important to keep RIA market penetration in mind. Looks like java is picking up support though:
http://www.stat...wl.com/java.php

]]> By: Sun Prepares To Unleash JavaFX | Widgets Lab http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2513356 Sun Prepares To Unleash JavaFX | Widgets Lab Sun, 26 Oct 2008 01:25:14 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2513356 [...] TC Technorati Tags: Sun MicroSystems,Sun Java,Java,Java SE,Java SE 6,Java SE 6 Update [...] [...] TC Technorati Tags: Sun MicroSystems,Sun Java,Java,Java SE,Java SE 6,Java SE 6 Update [...]

]]> By: kernel http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2512850 kernel Sat, 25 Oct 2008 00:27:41 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2512850 not at all. it's only your ignorance. Java Kernel is a subset of the JRE. However, after Java Kernel completes downloading and installing the rest of the bundles downloaded by Download Manager, it will be identical (bit by bit) to a JRE. http://java.sun.com/javase/6/6u10faq.jsp#JKernel not at all. it’s only your ignorance.

Java Kernel is a subset of the JRE. However, after Java Kernel completes downloading and installing the rest of the bundles downloaded by Download Manager, it will be identical (bit by bit) to a JRE.
http://java.sun...faq.jsp#JKernel

]]> By: martin http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2512554 martin Fri, 24 Oct 2008 18:51:36 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2512554 I first knew Java back in 1998, when it was supposed to be an applet language, cross platform. I worked at an Apple dealer back then, so I made a Java applet. I got disappointed, because Java Applet was not cross platform. Then come JSP, and the plumbing between apache and tomcat was too clumsy. I think the winners in web applications are: - PHP for the server side (facebook is a good sample) - Flash for RIA - VB6 and .NET for corporate developers - MSVC for commercial developers. - Adobe suite for designers... Martin I first knew Java back in 1998, when it was supposed to be an applet language, cross platform. I worked at an Apple dealer back then, so I made a Java applet. I got disappointed, because Java Applet was not cross platform. Then come JSP, and the plumbing between apache and tomcat was too clumsy. I think the winners in web applications are:
- PHP for the server side (facebook is a good sample)
- Flash for RIA
- VB6 and .NET for corporate developers
- MSVC for commercial developers.
- Adobe suite for designers…

Martin

]]> By: Ivo's Blog - jansch.nl » Blog Archive » Client side Java, Take Two http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2511905 Ivo's Blog - jansch.nl » Blog Archive » Client side Java, Take Two Thu, 23 Oct 2008 20:40:20 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2511905 [...] Sun, who years ago created the RIA avant la lettre with their Java applets, must have watched this trend in amazement. And now that RIA's are in the early adopter stage and have enough momentum to become mainstream, it's time for them to give it another try. They are relaunching the applet idea with what they call 'JavaFX' (come on, that name just sounds like 'fancy button' all over again). Details on this can be read in this article on TechCrunch. [...] [...] Sun, who years ago created the RIA avant la lettre with their Java applets, must have watched this trend in amazement. And now that RIA’s are in the early adopter stage and have enough momentum to become mainstream, it’s time for them to give it another try. They are relaunching the applet idea with what they call ‘JavaFX’ (come on, that name just sounds like ‘fancy button’ all over again). Details on this can be read in this article on TechCrunch. [...]

]]> By: land_mammal http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2510820 land_mammal Wed, 22 Oct 2008 23:42:37 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2510820 JavaFX on the front sounds interesting, but it has a while to go to catch up. Maybe it can in a year. The Flex-Java integration with BlazeDS is really good. I would assume that MS will have good .NET integration so javaFX better play nice with Java back ends too. Flex has tons of component libraries and out there armies of blue haired designer types that make things look cool using Adobe products. So basically, I think Sun is doing the right thing, but they are a little late to the party unless MS and Adobe totally fall over. I can see JavaFX gaining traction in computationally expensive apps that need the leverage the Java VM. Maybe in research, universities, and large companies. Either way it will be fun to watch. JavaFX on the front sounds interesting, but it has a while to go to catch up. Maybe it can in a year. The Flex-Java integration with BlazeDS is really good. I would assume that MS will have good .NET integration so javaFX better play nice with Java back ends too. Flex has tons of component libraries and out there armies of blue haired designer types that make things look cool using Adobe products. So basically, I think Sun is doing the right thing, but they are a little late to the party unless MS and Adobe totally fall over. I can see JavaFX gaining traction in computationally expensive apps that need the leverage the Java VM. Maybe in research, universities, and large companies. Either way it will be fun to watch.

]]> By: diatribe http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2509811 diatribe Wed, 22 Oct 2008 03:08:07 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2509811 wow... sun is releasing a new framework for <em>java applets</em>? wtf would anyone writing apps/widgets/applets for today's Internet care? ah, so that would explain why eclipse sucks so bad....it is a java app! slow, resource hungry, outdated ui...makes perfect sense now. give me a break with the dotm w/re2 java being "the" enterprise language. the language is nice, no doubt about that. the jvm/jre and all the other "baggage" that goes with it makes it so much more unpleasant. just because java has now become the "lowest common denominator" of programming languages does not, in any way, make it a "good thing" - look at pascal.... (lot of that being used in "modern" technologies eh?) wow… sun is releasing a new framework for java applets? wtf would anyone writing apps/widgets/applets for today’s Internet care?

ah, so that would explain why eclipse sucks so bad….it is a java app! slow, resource hungry, outdated ui…makes perfect sense now.

give me a break with the dotm w/re2 java being “the” enterprise language. the language is nice, no doubt about that. the jvm/jre and all the other “baggage” that goes with it makes it so much more unpleasant.

just because java has now become the “lowest common denominator” of programming languages does not, in any way, make it a “good thing” – look at pascal…. (lot of that being used in “modern” technologies eh?)

]]> By: Joey Gibson http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2509793 Joey Gibson Wed, 22 Oct 2008 02:50:16 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2509793 As for Java being pre-installed on OSX, that's an ancient version. Apple has only just released Java 1.6_07 a few weeks ago, and it's ONLY for 64bit machines. As for Java being pre-installed on OSX, that’s an ancient version. Apple has only just released Java 1.6_07 a few weeks ago, and it’s ONLY for 64bit machines.

]]> By: JKTidd http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2509406 JKTidd Tue, 21 Oct 2008 21:38:59 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2509406 A recent Gartner report claims about 75% of large enterprise applications are Java (server side of course) as compared to 25% for Microsoft. To say Microsoft is an enterprise standard seems unlikely. What's Silverlight's install percentage? 95% like Flash? Don't think so. And last time I looked Silverlight didn't even allow printing. Also don't think they have binary data transfer like Flex's AMF protocol, etc, etc. They're still trying to play catchup in a big way... As for JavaFX, it's been out for over a year and good luck finding anybody actually using it. Maybe some day... A recent Gartner report claims about 75% of large enterprise applications are Java (server side of course) as compared to 25% for Microsoft. To say Microsoft is an enterprise standard seems unlikely.

What’s Silverlight’s install percentage? 95% like Flash? Don’t think so.
And last time I looked Silverlight didn’t even allow printing. Also don’t think they have binary data transfer like Flex’s AMF protocol, etc, etc.

They’re still trying to play catchup in a big way…

As for JavaFX, it’s been out for over a year and good luck finding anybody actually using it. Maybe some day…

]]> By: Dating 2.0 http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2509336 Dating 2.0 Tue, 21 Oct 2008 20:18:10 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2509336 There are still a few of us coding client side Java :) Our next generation dating site is a Java applet; Check it out here - http://socialbang.com/go (no sign up needed) Browser based Java can recover, but Sun needs to get the development tools and presentation right for JavaFX There are still a few of us coding client side Java :)

Our next generation dating site is a Java applet;

Check it out here – http://socialbang.com/go (no sign up needed)

Browser based Java can recover, but Sun needs to get the development tools and presentation right for JavaFX

]]> By: javaguy http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2509319 javaguy Tue, 21 Oct 2008 19:59:24 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2509319 Java has a huge advantage in terms of 3d graphics. ALSO, java is built to handle multi core processing very well as it has a good threading model. Flash is single threaded crap. Java has a bright future now. Java has a huge advantage in terms of 3d graphics. ALSO, java is built to handle multi core processing very well as it has a good threading model. Flash is single threaded crap. Java has a bright future now.

]]> By: Bart Czernicki http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2509201 Bart Czernicki Tue, 21 Oct 2008 17:48:04 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2509201 You are right on Flash being not multithreaded is going to KILL them. If you go to dell now the standard is to get Quad Core computers. Flash leverages 1/4 of the computing power on the computer (I know that the hardware does some multithreading for u even for single thread apps). If you research Flash and multithreading my Silverlight blog pops up #6 on google. That is ridiculous :) On my site I wrote some aricles on gaining as much as 120% performance improvements by spinning up multiple threads for computation. You are right on Flash being not multithreaded is going to KILL them. If you go to dell now the standard is to get Quad Core computers. Flash leverages 1/4 of the computing power on the computer (I know that the hardware does some multithreading for u even for single thread apps).

If you research Flash and multithreading my Silverlight blog pops up #6 on google. That is ridiculous :) On my site I wrote some aricles on gaining as much as 120% performance improvements by spinning up multiple threads for computation.

]]> By: Bart Czernicki http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2509194 Bart Czernicki Tue, 21 Oct 2008 17:43:45 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2509194 @Venkat, People say that Microsoft has a monopoly in Windows...that holds more true for the enterprise than anything. Take a poll of Fortune 500 based companies and a big majority of them are Microsoft-based. Who cares about non-windows based enterprise deployments if you are Microsoft? Flex plays exceedingly well with .net back ends? better than Silverlight???? If I want to refactor code and move it from the client Silverlight and move it to the service layer or business logic on the web server...I can simply COPY AND PASTE. Can you do that with a Flash front-end and a .NET backend? If I want to develop a Silverlight RIA...I am using one language and ONE toolset. In Flash I have a seperate tool for building the UI and then need another tool for the backend. Not too mention the fact people already familiar with WCF, WPF or C# are already 40% of the way there with language and design comapred to a Flash developer. Throw in some other big facts like Flash can't do true multithreading and you have a complete package of why Flash will not mature into an enterprise product. @Venkat,

People say that Microsoft has a monopoly in Windows…that holds more true for the enterprise than anything. Take a poll of Fortune 500 based companies and a big majority of them are Microsoft-based. Who cares about non-windows based enterprise deployments if you are Microsoft?

Flex plays exceedingly well with .net back ends? better than Silverlight???? If I want to refactor code and move it from the client Silverlight and move it to the service layer or business logic on the web server…I can simply COPY AND PASTE. Can you do that with a Flash front-end and a .NET backend? If I want to develop a Silverlight RIA…I am using one language and ONE toolset. In Flash I have a seperate tool for building the UI and then need another tool for the backend.

Not too mention the fact people already familiar with WCF, WPF or C# are already 40% of the way there with language and design comapred to a Flash developer.

Throw in some other big facts like Flash can’t do true multithreading and you have a complete package of why Flash will not mature into an enterprise product.

]]> By: Alamgir Kahn http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2509190 Alamgir Kahn Tue, 21 Oct 2008 17:42:39 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2509190 Are you out of your mind? Java is not close to dead. If you mean on the client-side, and SPECIFICALLY applets, you may be right, but when it comes to server-side languages, C# doesn't even come close: http://www.langpop.com/ Are you out of your mind? Java is not close to dead. If you mean on the client-side, and SPECIFICALLY applets, you may be right, but when it comes to server-side languages, C# doesn’t even come close:

http://www.langpop.com/

]]> By: Alamgir Kahn http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2509183 Alamgir Kahn Tue, 21 Oct 2008 17:38:23 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2509183 Your alpaca had me dying on the floor laughing Your alpaca had me dying on the floor laughing

]]> By: LOL :D http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2509176 LOL :D Tue, 21 Oct 2008 17:32:56 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2509176 The end-user experience is horrible, deplorable even! No less than 3 dialogs are presented to the user, the last of which requries user interaction. And all this just to watch a "swirrly square" demo. Adobe Flash / Flex is a much better experience. The end-user experience is horrible, deplorable even! No less than 3 dialogs are presented to the user, the last of which requries user interaction. And all this just to watch a “swirrly square” demo. Adobe Flash / Flex is a much better experience.

]]> By: LOL :D http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2509171 LOL :D Tue, 21 Oct 2008 17:25:23 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2509171 Just went to download the JRE 6update 10, and it shows a download size of 15.52 MB, not 4.5 MB as advertised in this article. Although, I could care less since I have a 10 mbps connection. Just went to download the JRE 6update 10, and it shows a download size of 15.52 MB, not 4.5 MB as advertised in this article. Although, I could care less since I have a 10 mbps connection.

]]> By: ck http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2509168 ck Tue, 21 Oct 2008 17:14:14 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2509168 Seriously dude, you need to read more. If anything the .NET community is in a recession due to LAMP and the abundance of start ups. Seriously dude, you need to read more. If anything the .NET community is in a recession due to LAMP and the abundance of start ups.

]]> By: ck http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2509166 ck Tue, 21 Oct 2008 17:11:08 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2509166 doh! I meant GWT. doh! I meant GWT.

]]> By: ck http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2509162 ck Tue, 21 Oct 2008 17:09:39 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2509162 More like, javascript is such a clusterfuck only google nerds can program it right. But hey, that's what GTK is for. More like, javascript is such a clusterfuck only google nerds can program it right. But hey, that’s what GTK is for.

]]> By: Huh? http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2509160 Huh? Tue, 21 Oct 2008 17:08:42 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2509160 Are you kidding me? What rock do you live under? Are you kidding me? What rock do you live under?

]]> By: ck http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2509159 ck Tue, 21 Oct 2008 17:06:33 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2509159 I'd rather take a knife to the stomach than work with Flash/Flex again. AS3 is a pathetic little language compared to Java and makes life miserable for real developers who are aware of best practices. I’d rather take a knife to the stomach than work with Flash/Flex again. AS3 is a pathetic little language compared to Java and makes life miserable for real developers who are aware of best practices.

]]> By: Huh? http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2509153 Huh? Tue, 21 Oct 2008 17:02:15 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2509153 Yeah, 18 months ago. Did you see the date of the post? Yeah, 18 months ago. Did you see the date of the post?

]]> By: WTF? http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2509145 WTF? Tue, 21 Oct 2008 16:57:50 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2509145 Are you serious? A bubble animation application? WTF? Are you serious? A bubble animation application? WTF?

]]> By: Uh, Yup! http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/20/sun-prepares-ria-resurgence-with-new-java-release/comment-page-1/#comment-2509141 Uh, Yup! Tue, 21 Oct 2008 16:55:13 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/?p=23560#comment-2509141 I couldn't agree more! Don't get me wrong, Java is THE solution for the server side, but under no circumstances for the client side. I couldn’t agree more! Don’t get me wrong, Java is THE solution for the server side, but under no circumstances for the client side.

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