Today, Democratic Presidential candidate Barack Obama voted for H.R.6304, which amends the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (F.I.S.A). In doing so he voted to give telecommunication providers immunity against civil damages that they might incur in the course of enabling the government to execute wiretaps and other types of electronic surveillance. He did so, after an amendment to the bill that would have stripped out the immunity provision, S.Amdt. 5064, was defeated 32-66. In voting for the bill, Obama acted in direct contradiction to his earlier statements. In 2007 Bill Burton, an Obama campaign spokesman, said “To be clear: Barack will support a filibuster of any bill that includes retroactive immunity for telecommunications companies.”
The original F.I.S.A statute was passed in 1978 in order to protect civil liberties against overly expansive government surveillance, and had clear penalties of $100 per person, per day, plus punitive damages, for telecommunications companies that conducted electronic surveillance without judicial oversight. Given that each day tens of millions of people have their data go across the networks of some of the larger telcos, the risk that these companies faced by working with the government on extra-judicial wiretaps was extreme. In giving companies that work with the government immunity from these penalties, H.R. 6304, and Barack Obama who voted for it, just took away the only reason stopping AT&T, Verizon, and others from helping the government use extra-judicial wiretaps. In voting for the bill, Obama not only helped the telco’s, but also broke his promise to protect the American people from expansive government surveillance.
The image above was created with this site, which lets you add whatever message you want to Obama’s campaign platform.
Note that TechCrunch endorsed Barack Obama, partially on his policies towards telecommunications companies.
Who’s Barack Obama??
Its ok .. I still love you ‘bama
People can change their minds but when a politician does it we call it Flip Flop…not saying that he chose a better option…
I refreshed the page a few times, got a John McCain ad every time. wtf
Let this be a reminder that Americans must stop waiting for one individual to make great change in America. If Americans desire ‘real change’, they can do so today by uniting in great numbers to shift the course of America’s future.
Since 1913, the government hasn’t truly been a friend of the people, but an enemy. Let’s face reality, folks: Nothing will change in Washington, D.C. as long as you expect it to be the point of change.
‘Real change’ starts in your heart, mind, soul, spirit, home and community. As long as we go home each day, insulating our lives in soulless bubbles fed by the garbage on our TVs and radios, we’ll never witness the beauty of real freedom and prosperity in America.
Change is up to you, America. Not Barack Obama, John McCain or anyone else.
Good luck my USA comrades, I believe you will need it during you descent into a totalitarian state.
Seriously, viewing from the outside: Holy F*cking Sh*t.
Well, Europe isn’t any better if that’s what you’re aiming at. Sweden’s got the FRA, the British government is going to have authority to require private encryption keys, and so on.
Saying he would support a filibuster does not make voting to approve the bill a lie. And that’s how politicians teach tech blogs a lesson.
I WAS an obama supporter. After spending over $500 on campaign contribution and buying stuffs to support him to become the next president because of his promise and his position in the past on Iraq and FISA. Now that he has the necessary support, he intends to do away with it and has clearly steer in a different direction. Namely, his speech to AIPAC. He said that he would fund $30B for Israel defense and remove threat from Iran. These two points did rile me up. He wanted to incite the need to get into war. In addition, he said Jeruleslam (?) will remain intact and be part of Israel. His language was stronger.
Now with the FISA voting to give retroactive immunity and expansive executive eavesdropping power WITHOUT court order is blantantly absurd and abuse of the Constitution 4th amendment. I find it applauding that the words of George Bush still holds true as he erode the rights bestow upon us by the Constitution that the Constitution is just a piece of paper.
All great empire will come to an end. This end is always and will always be within.
“I know it was you Fredo, you broke my heart”
Pelosi and Reid are the real problems here, but Obama made a deal with the devil on this one. Democrats are running scared.
From a foreign and international perspective, first of all, regardless of the issue:
1) Techcrunch supported Obama so for you to do a negative story is very far from professional considering the negative weight it can have not just with undecided voters but also the general population.
2) If he didn’t move in this direction, people would claim that he’s “suporting the terrorist” By the way, the government does not care about your phonecall with your mom and girlfriend. If you’re not doing anything illegal you shouldn’t worry but if the next phonecall can stop 5000 people from dying, why not listen. I used to be against this until I read the facts.
3) I go to Techcrunch because I appreciate Michael Arrington’s very professional business on delivering the most updated news spanning all over the world and changing the way news is delivered and affecting big decisions large CEOs in the software industry take and not to get into heated political debates because that’s the job of things like Politico.com. I hope you don’t loose that appeal
Thanks for the Story anyway!
The facts? The flying f—ing facts? You have got to be kidding me.
As the days go on, Obama will turn more and more centrist to appease more voters. He clarified his position on supporting the FISA bill with its warrantless wiretapping and telecom criminal immunity by giving a speech today saying it’s for the good of the country. Wait until the Iraq War is good for the country. The Afghan War being good for the country. The increase in the military by an additional 92,000 troops good for the country. Deficit spending being good for the country.
Hope and change, indeed.
Why is this on Techcrunch?
This makes about as much sense as Google getting into the Virtual World space.
On another note, I don’t agree with everything Obama does, but undoubtedly he has more character and integrity than almost any candidate we’ve seen in a while.
What would happen if he did vote to prosecute. Would that have an impact on him winning the presidency? of course it would.
Hes doing what he has to do to win…Politics is a game. Hes playing it very well.. i doubt he would do the same if he was already president. Win first then make your point
Please consider voting Mccain everyone. Both Mccain and Obama are drifters to the center, but Mccain is a greater patriot than Osama, I mean Obama. Afterall, who wants a President (with a capital P) whose pastor chants “G-D damn America,” and his cousins are Islamofascists.
And yet people wonder why the US is like it is…
Wasn’t this the dude you endorsed Michael?
anyone know if Basecamp is down today?
As an ouside observer I can only say: How the hell do you Americans put up with this?! No possible terrorist attack can be an excuse for this! I thoght Obama would make a differnece… now I’m more and more convinced that none of the candidates that come out of this system will ever make a difference…
I’m voting Ron Paul as a write-in candidate. Both Obama and McCain are unacceptable to me.
Get this crap off TechCrunch.
Who cares? Obama has this thing in the bag. Noone is going to vote for another term of George Bush(McCain), and Obama can flip flop on 90% of the issues and he’ll be a smaller flip flopper than McCain.
If McCain from 2000 was running I’d vote for him. But the current McCain will just continue shitting all over the conservative principles, just like Bushie did the second he got into the white house, so fuck Bush and fuck McCain, maybe in 2004 the GOP will nominate a real conservative.
I’m all for going to the center, but McCain is going to the center on all the wrong issues, while keeping all the batshit crazy policies that make most people ashamed of being republicans.
It’s 2008 now.
eh I meant to say 2012
Which way did McCaine vote?
“He did so, after an amendment to the bill that would have stripped out the immunity provision, S.Amdt. 5064, was defeated 32-66.”
I’m not a big Obama supporter, but the devil is always in the details. Hence, if there were changes Barack Obama deemed problematic, then he likely did what he thought was in the best interests of Americans given the specific language of the bill.
I don’t think this is a big deal.
WHY ARE WE DISCUSSING POLITICS ON THIS FREAKING BLOG?????
NEXT..
@19 I totally agree!
Last I checked this wasn’t some whiny political blog. Maybe you meant to post this on your PERSONAL blog.
When are you going to realize, the democrats never have, nor will amount to anything. The only time they appear to rise, is when the republicans have done or not done something, but NEVER because of anything that the democrats actually accomplished. Face it, this United Empire of America is headed towards its demise as evident by the katrina fiasco, etc. and will take another 50 years to rise back to its glory days when you could go to the washington monument with a six pack, a boom box, and boogey all night long under the fourth of july fireworks. I miss those days.
Ben Batshit, I mean, Bahkshi - go hang out on the fox news website - please.
Yeah Dmitry #10, you got a point, makes me sick to see this blog gets political and now we have respectable international input from you and too bad it’s counteracted by negativity from people like #14 Ben Bakhashi, a racist guy from Israel with a pro israel blog telling Americans how to vote. Thanks a lot for the advise. We don’t need it. If I were you I would work on figuring out why you guys lost against Hezbollah and start reaching out for neighbors that despise you. I mean, forget Arab, Jew, Muslim, Christian. Just think of the concept of a state that exists knowing it’s not accepted by all its neighbors, how do you guys live like that. What kind of a miserable life is that? Why not work towards peace. 15 surrounding countries can’t be all wrong, how can Israel fix itself and reach out, these are things to think of instead of spreading your hate to America, I’m white and will vote for Obama and more whites will vote for him than for Mc Cain because despite the fact that he’s not perfect, he’s a sincere person a change to the mentality and I agree with the above comment that the real change will come within us not from Obama but he’ll be a great tole model
Mike, fire this guy and if you want to make posts like this put it on crunchnotes so i don’t have to read it.
These issues were very important in Mike’s interviews on the whole Tech President thing. I hope that when you do the general election endorsements, you remember this…
I appreciate the tech-relevant politics coverage. It’s too bad that the politicians are so anti-tech.
well one good thing came out of this post is that it help out this retard Ben Bakhsi. Guaranteed never to post again with the same handle. perhaps he can get a job as IT guru for the mccain camp. Go T. Boone Pickens. We need more americans like him.
three things:
1) obama’s previous statement referred only to retroactive immunity, not immunity in general
2) i wish we’d stop using the term “flip flop” in our political discourse. it’s way too laced with bitter connotations by this point.
3) if there’s a problem here, it’s with a government impinging on civil liberties, not the corporations that it coerces into helping it do so.
I believe the point is that the amendment that was stripped out would have to have passed in order for Obama’s vote to be consistent with his past statements. The fact the the amendment was stripped, and even after this fact Obama still voted to support the bill, that is where the problem lies.
For those of you unfamiliar with these “details”, Obama had previously made a point of opposing any sort of retroactive immunity for the telecoms. The bill that he now voted for effectively grants retroactive immunity. He made a statement that gathered him a lot of support, and then he voted in a manner contradictory to his stated belief, and contrary to the beliefs of a number of his supporters. And that’s why some people aren’t happy, although in all honesty, this won’t be a serious issue either way. Apparently only fringe groups care about these wild ideas like civil rights.
1. Barack stance is that telco’s should not be punished for what the federal gov’t asked them to do for national security. I get the impression that most of you have no clue as to what this bill means other than someone spying on your porn surfing habits. You should be pissed at the Bush administration/ NSA and not the telco’s.
sorry. immunity. it’s not retroactive. yet.
Boy, I sure wish this was relevant.
It hurts to find out that Obama is all talk.
I had high hopes for Obama. When it comes right down to it, I don’t think he knows what the hell he’s doing. He’s in over his head.
Everybody should relax… 69 senators - including 21 democrats - voted for this bill so there was a lot of support. I do believe that people suing for everything they don’t like is way out of control. Web sites like being protected from liability when users of their sites libel others or post illegal content. Why shouldn’t Obama be pro-business and support restrictions on lawsuits resulting from obeying law-enforcement requests?
Dan K - this is a pretty ridiculous post. What about the angle that McCain is a coward for not voting at all on such a controversial bill?
That is TechCrunch’s love affair with Obama comes crashing down. Wait for more. This is politics and politicians have not friends or foes.
“15 surrounding countries can’t be all wrong” The same 15 countries that support 9/11. I’m an American and damn proud. Just as any Italian wants Italy to be in peace, I am a Jew that wants Israel to live in peace. Why don’t you read what I write instead of jumping to conclusions. What is your idea of “working towards peace.” Peace is a state of mind.
Keep yapping though, but remember, 1 mouth, 2 ears. One day you’ll realize that Israel has a right to exist next to people who don’t want its complete destruction.
Btw. You are barking up the wrong tree, the Google guys are also two major supporters of Israel and her defense. Maybe you should boycott Google because they are Jewish.
Pretty balsy story, Techcrunch. Stay out of politics if you don’t want to lose subscribers, and the phony premise that you’re only writing this story because of the telecommunications connection is bogus.
Had you done more research or maybe avoided the Obama Koolaid, you would have endorsed Ron Paul, who has always voted against these kinds of awful government intrusions on our freedoms.
i want to cut his nuts out!!
Was it a boring day in the office guys? Why in the world is this lukewarm political commentary considered appropriate for TechCrunch? You guys are losing your focus.
What does it matter?…They both “flip-flop”, so, pick your poison
Or the third option: http://www.campaignforliberty.com/
And, Techcruch, I’m glad you ran this story. More people need to be involved and aware with whats happening all around them; Please, please, please open your eyes. Light a fire and do some research-at least for your own sake!
Isn’t it entrapment for the government to persuade an entity to commit a crime and then prosecute them for it? In other words, doesn’t this bill really come down to preventing a whole bag full of frivolous law suits, due to the fact that the government can’t prosecute the telephone companies since they were assuaged that they were not violating the law by the government?
Obama broke his promise, but it’s probably for the better.
Barack Obama is a disgusting piece of shit — and this is coming form a Democrat who voted for him. What a betrayal of values. Obama — if you can’t win without going center, don’t run. And don’t push the only liberal — Edwards — out of the race, by lying to, and tapping financial support of Silicon Valley.
I thought this was a great article. Good to see some range on this blog. I’m just glad it wasn’t Twitter voting for the bill…
i am disappointed as you all, but really do we want another republican? there are problems, but its better than the alternative. mccain doesn’t even use a computer. come on, be realistic.
Over the next several months (and the four years that follow, if elected) it will be fascinating to watch the Obama’s lemming-like followers become increasingly disillusioned as they realize he’s a politician, nothing more.
like this is anything new? all libtards are flip flopping faggots
Techcrunch seems to support policies in favor of Osama.
There’s about 30 million liberal bloggers ranting about this non-stop. Do I really have to read about it on techcrunch too?
Dan Kimerling has a few basic (and glaring) questions to address. What was Obama’s reasoning? Why did he vote this way? How was the amendment changed and compromised from where it started?
I know you’re a blogger and all, but this “news” post is crap. Try harder, Dan.
Did TechCrunch just jump the shark?
If Obama didn’t do this, he would have been attacked by the republicans for not keeping america safe by not allowing for wiretaps. It was a wise move.
Jeepers, you admit it yourself: Obama never said he’d vote against the bill. Just that he’d “support” a filibuster in a certain case. He voted three times to remove the provision. If he doesn’t have the votes to filibuster, what’s the point? To make a few of you feel better?
I’M SHOCKED…..I’M SHOCKED!
A politician who SAYS one thing and DOES another!
All you PINHEADS who believe - THERE’S A CHANGE A COMIN’ - Dream On !
This post has done enormous damage to your credibility as a reliable source for upto date tech news! Are you that hungry for traffic?
there is only one party, and when a = b and you really want c, there is no choice
Hopefully the zombies will wake up and realize that democrats are not the future and neither are the republicans.
This is not the man I supported financially and with my voice for the past year. I’m angry, shocked and depressed. I no longer have a candidate.
WTF happened?
Twitter for President
Ben Bakhshi,
Well, maybe one way of working towards peace is realizing that 15 of your neighbor countries that surround you are not all terrorists and “support 9/11″ I mean listen to yourself saying that, really ignorant. I was on a business trip in the Middle East with a group of Israeli and Arab business people who were speaking very civilized talk and accepting each other and proposing great solutions involving business collaboration but we don’t hear about that side of the story, why? You run a blog and should take a positive step promoting peace and since peace is a state of mind like you say, why not share that same peace of mind with other people. One of the most exciting web companies appearing is G.ho.st http://jewschool.com/2008/05/2.....palestine/
it’s a joint collaboration between Israeli and Palestenian programmers who can’t see each other due to a dividing wall, what a sad yet encouraging story full of hope. Did you know that you have the power in your hands to make such difference rather than sit and point the finger at Islamofacists, Israel will be accepted by it’s neighbors and to everyone who believes that peace in the middle east will not be achieved, they’re hopless souls, unlike what most people think this hasn’t been going on for 2000 years, just 60 to be precise, the creation of Israel was a needed matter but also an awkward experience for it’s neighbors and couldve been done in a better way. The bottom line is that the majority of the population would rather have peace and you should be a role model for this if this is really what you want to achieve, not a role model for leaving such a childish comment like the first one. Constructive comments go way further and actually change opinions.
Sorry for turning this into a political blog but I’m quite sure that techcrunch got that snowball rolling started
I think what is happening is that the Bush Administration is making certain senators (especially presidential candidates like Obama) privy to “intelligence briefings” that have stacked “information” designed to scare them into supporting the wiretapping, based on false or trumped-up pretenses (much like the justifications for invading Iraq).
In other words, the Bush Admin. really “needs” Obama to support wiretapping immunity for the telcos, for two reasons:
1) It advances a key Bush Administration policy position (thus undermining citizens’ rights), by scaring Obama into voting to keep the measures in place; and
2) It also, conveniently, makes Obama look like a flip-flopping hypocrite who really doesn’t care about our constitutional rights.
So, it accomplishes two key Bush Administration goals simultaneously… typical Rovian tactic.
Probably what they’ve done is given Obama secret briefings about potential “threats” to US security, including threats of “imminent terrorist incidents”, that have been, or are on the verge of, being thwarted by the warrantless wiretapping, and “evidence” that the warrantless wiretapping must continue in its present (unconstitutional) form in order to continue to thwart those “imminent attacks”.
Of course, the Bushies can manufacture any kind of evidence they want to. Since they are privy to reams and reams of “chatter” and data from intelligence agencies around the world every day, they can easily construct or manufacture a “scenario” which fits those needs, and then feed them to Obama under the guise of an “intelligence briefing”.
And of course, Obama can’t discuss this with the general public, or even other senators who aren’t given the briefings.
Really, the only Senators and House members who are generally given these briefings would probably be those on the select intelligence committees, and probably the House Speaker and majority and minority leaders in both houses.
Nefarious? But of course. But this is precisely the strategy that Rove and Cheney have most likely put into place. Remember Colin Powell’s slide show at the UN. (Most likely, even Powell himself never knew that the “evidence” of WMD was specious.)
LOL. I have been telling all my friends their enthusiasm for Obama is not warrented. He is proving me right even before election.
I’m posting this idea here because it’s a likely spot to see the eyes of an entrepreneur will some time/connections.
Please create a non-profit organization and sell little stickers I can put on my phone, such as:
WARNING: This device may be used to illegally eavesdrop on conversations. Brought to you by a cooperation between AT&T and Richard Burr - R - North Carolina.
Of course, you’ll need a variety of stickers for each member of congress and the telecommunications company.
At a minimum, I’d like it to have an official looking “eagle” like seal. If possible, find a creative way to show how much money has been contributed via opensecrets.org.
All money raised should go to the campaigns of those opposing these members in the next election.
When techcrunch starts covering daily politics and Obama no longer gives a shit about the American people, it’s finally time to pack my bags and move on up to Canada….
Europe is a lot more fun. Most countries’ people understand American English very well, too.
Dan, nice attempt to sound intelligent.
Are you really that naive? Obama is not the messiah some have made him out to be, he’s a politician. He will tell you what you want to hear, or make vague feel good statements like “Change” that allow you to interpret them how you wish. Then he panders to special interests who pay for his campaign so that he can WIN. It is all about WINNING and winning is all about MONEY. Sorry, but that is reality. Obama is no different from any other politician.
Dmitri,
I don’t know where you’re from, but in America it is not considered “unprofessional” to withdraw support from an elected representative when they contradict the values you initially supported them for. Reporting the FACT that Obama was staunchly pro-civil liberties and is now caving in the face of the mere threat of accusations of “un-Americanism” (an accusation which has worn very thin over the last 8 years) by voting for immunity for telcos is relevant to everyone in America who uses a phone or computer. The arguement that “if you haven’t done anything wrong then you have nothing to fear” is flat out contradictory to our Bill of Rights and the principals of freedom and liberty that our nation was founded on. Obviously if I’m being searched or surveilled, I am suspected of SOMETHING. Perhaps you are used to living your life under perpetual suspicion and law enforcement harassment and intimidation, but we in America are not, nor should we be. We like our old liberties, and the threat of another terrorist attack has been blown completely out of proportion. I think that if you actually HAD done the research you’re claiming, you would realize that yes, they will listen to my calls to my mom and girlfriend simply due to the sheer volume of calls and emails they now monitor. Washington is in the process of enlisting one half of the nation to supervise and report the other, and technology is paving the way for Thought Police, which is why this is very alarming.
Thanks for the uninformed comment anyways.
It’s interesting that there’s no mention of McCain’s “flip flops” when he’s been at the heart of countless “flip flops.” So this is the type of articles TC wants to get into? I sure hope not.
On the actual issue: a lot of people appear to be raising hell over this against Obama, despite really considering all sides of the story. It’s as if no one really understands the compromise or the actual issue. Suing some executives of corporations over Bush’s actions and pressure doesn’t solve anything. Getting rid of Bush and his disastrous policies will.
It looks like all the doe-eyed Obama fans got their cherry popped a little bit early. So… surprise! Obama is a politician, and he’s more than willing to betray his principles (or at least his stated principles) if he thinks it will help him get or retain power. His campaign is going to make a marvelous case study for how people can get completely suckered and buy an empty box just on the basis of good branding. It may turn out that Obama wins just because of his choice of the Gotham font and that lovely shade of blue in all his posters. Typography you can believe in.
If this wasn’t enough, one more reason to encrypt your data.
Speaking of personal data and encryption, *TIP* for TC Editors:
“Google has confirmed that personal data of U.S. employees hired prior to 2006 have been stolen in a recent burglary.”
http://news.zdnet.com/2100-1009_22-6243093.html
Guillaume
http://www.cGeep.com
(The simple Way to Encrypt Files and Emails)
What is your point exactly? You want us to vote for McCain?
Newsflash, Politicians are liars, even well educated black politicians.
At least they’re not as bad as Canadians.
Say what you will about McCain, but he is an American Patriot thru and thru. This guy was a prisoner of war for years. When his captors found out that his father and grandfather were both admirals in the US Navy, they wanted to release him. McCain refused the special treatment, and would not leave until the prisoners that arrived before him were released. In other words, he continued to suffer for years at the hands of these psychos because he wanted to protect his countrymen. Maybe he’s crazy, but any man that will take endless beatings and suffer as much as he did for another American that HE DOESN’T EVEN KNOW is a solid individual in my book. That’s exactly the kind of guy that I want leading my country. Talk about integrity…..that pretty much defines it for me.
I agree that Obama is engaging and interesting (because he’s different and not the cookie cutter politician), but his politics are too fickle for me. Plus, the fact that he turned down McCain’s request to have town-hall meetings tells me that he’s not comfortable with the issues and is afraid that he can’t stand toe-to-toe with McCain. I’ll take someone like McCain any day.
I hope all Americans look at these two and think about the issues and not just vote because someone is cool or different. I’d much rather have a President that can find Iran on the map as opposed to one who is cool because he fist-bumps his wife.
Read my lips, no …. new … taxes.
I’m getting a kick that people are surprised.
I’m sorry… I come to this blog for tech news… not politics. If you want to write articles like this, start a political blog.
Sad. Your professionalism stock just dropped in my opinion.
Wow…what a desparate article. How many pageviews did this one generate for you guys?
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/Arti...../20080227/
“Barack Obama has ratcheted up his attacks on NAFTA, but a senior member of his campaign team told a Canadian official not to take his criticisms seriously, CTV News has learned.”
Obama has done this before. He said he would protect the United States against NAFTA and other imbalances, and talked tough, then had his people call Canada and tell them it was only cheap talk.
As somebody who has suffered the Canadian experience, I am certain I would never even think of voting for someone who sympathizes with supporting Canadian socialism/communism over America and Americans.
I don’t care if every factory and worker in Canada goes on employment insurance, and if their govt subsidized softwood lumber rots.
My LLC should have low taxes and I should have ever advantage possible over my Canadian, Indian, Chinese and Mexican counterpart.
I want a president who will give me the America rewards advantage.
The advantage to create a huge company and crush my foreign small business competitors.
That should read “every advantage possible” over my foreign counterparts.
What the hell kind of story is this on TechCrunch? This is garbage and a thinly veiled political post, not a tech post.
I thought this was a great post- especially after TechCrunch endorsed Obama. It’s good to see that a blog follows the news regarding its preferred candidate and I believe it’s relevant due to the technological nature of the bill.
@Brian,
He may be the most patriotic person in the U.S. but that does not necessarily make him the best president. If you look at McCain’s record he has been getting a red carpet treatment since his birth. Free fame based on the hard work his father and grandfather did. Name one important change he did for the U.S. since he has been in the senate…
If TechCrunch wants to have a political voice, then how about creating a new blog for it. This was a blatant political statement clumsily wrapped around a “technology” issue. Very disappointing.
There are some assertions here that range from a little silly to downright ludicrous. In no particular order: