Comments on: Memo To UK: No Pandora For You http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/ Startup and Technology News Sun, 20 Jul 2008 00:51:58 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.5.1 By: Marcus http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1926355 Marcus Thu, 17 Jan 2008 15:01:52 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1926355 17th Jan, and pandora is no more in the UK. Thank goodness for the people behind http://www.globalpandora.com The Box Is Open Again 17th Jan, and pandora is no more in the UK.

Thank goodness for the people behind http://www.globalpandora.com The Box Is Open Again

]]> By: Daniel Diver http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1920812 Daniel Diver Tue, 15 Jan 2008 11:36:44 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1920812 January 15th.. and I'm in the UK listening to Pandora. How come?! January 15th.. and I’m in the UK listening to Pandora. How come?!

]]> By: Michael Asoke http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1918732 Michael Asoke Mon, 14 Jan 2008 06:15:28 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1918732 I was blocked as well, and this is very unfortunate for consumers outside the USA. I do believe that in order to comply with licenses it's important for companies to do what they can to keep costs low. There are more restrictions with licenses being written into many developed sites like this now everyday. I'm a American that lives overseas and enjoys online gaming and also great music sites like Pandora. When this happens I can say it's quite devastating since I really don't have access to entertainment that others do. It's unfortunate you can't simply give them a ID or something to prove your American :) I was able to get back on the site by using a American VPN service like http://www.strongvpn.com or http://www.vpnaccounts.com . WIth VPN services these blockages are bypassed thankfully. But it sucks I have to pay more to see these sites now. I was blocked as well, and this is very unfortunate for consumers outside the USA. I do believe that in order to comply with licenses it’s important for companies to do what they can to keep costs low. There are more restrictions with licenses being written into many developed sites like this now everyday.

I’m a American that lives overseas and enjoys online gaming and also great music sites like Pandora. When this happens I can say it’s quite devastating since I really don’t have access to entertainment that others do. It’s unfortunate you can’t simply give them a ID or something to prove your American :)

I was able to get back on the site by using a American VPN service like http://www.strongvpn.com or http://www.vpnaccounts.com . WIth VPN services these blockages are bypassed thankfully. But it sucks I have to pay more to see these sites now.

]]> By: Harry Borlander http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1916912 Harry Borlander Sat, 12 Jan 2008 11:02:20 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1916912 I know you can use www.globalpandora.com in the UK with no worries. Harry I know you can use http://www.globalpandora.com in the UK with no worries.

Harry

]]> By: Albert http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1913244 Albert Thu, 10 Jan 2008 16:00:13 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1913244 Duncan - you are 100% wrong. It is nothing to do with the RIAA. This is solely a UK issue. Pandora made that very clear in its email. Think ill of the RIAA by all means, but at least get your facts straight. Very poor. Duncan - you are 100% wrong. It is nothing to do with the RIAA. This is solely a UK issue. Pandora made that very clear in its email. Think ill of the RIAA by all means, but at least get your facts straight.

Very poor.

]]> By: Paulo http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1911143 Paulo Wed, 09 Jan 2008 17:15:52 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1911143 Will sheeple die if they stop bleating "RIAA" every time there's a music story? This has nothing to do with the RIAA. Get a clue stick: the first "A" in RIAA stands for "Ass", the second "A" stands for "America". Duncan Riley should know better. Will sheeple die if they stop bleating “RIAA” every time there’s a music story? This has nothing to do with the RIAA.

Get a clue stick: the first “A” in RIAA stands for “Ass”, the second “A” stands for “America”.

Duncan Riley should know better.

]]> By: Camford http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1907791 Camford Tue, 08 Jan 2008 20:29:11 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1907791 For whatever reason it does seem to be mainly USA sites that restrict steaming music to their country only. I used to pay a subscription to MusicMatch radio untill they decided they did not want to take my money because I lived in NZ. I also used Pandora untill that stopped. I now use Last FM ,BBC radio,Songza,Seegpod and SkreemR and I know that there are other sites out there. The point I am making is that regardless of the RIAA or any other right organization I have no problem in playing any music I want. Pandora may be in a situation that is out of their control but if they are able to come to some arrangement latter on to broadcast outside the USA they may find that the rest of the world have moved on For whatever reason it does seem to be mainly USA sites that restrict steaming music to their country only.
I used to pay a subscription to MusicMatch radio untill they decided they did not want to take my money because I lived in NZ.
I also used Pandora untill that stopped.
I now use Last FM ,BBC radio,Songza,Seegpod and SkreemR and I know that there are other sites out there.
The point I am making is that regardless of the RIAA or any other right organization I have no problem in playing any music I want.
Pandora may be in a situation that is out of their control but if they are able to come to some arrangement latter on to broadcast outside the USA they may find that the rest of the world have moved on

]]> By: Jeremy http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1907369 Jeremy Tue, 08 Jan 2008 18:33:16 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1907369 I quote from the email that Pandora sent to its UK listeners - " Both the PPL (which represents the record labels) and the MCPS/PRS Alliance (which represents music publishers) have demanded per track performance minima rates which are far too high to allow ad supported radio to operate" This isn't about the RIAA (at least not directly, I suppose) but about the UK rights organisations. Licensing (for streaming music at least) is regulated where the listener is, not where the sending business is located. I think that Pandora blocked other countries in part, because of the difficulty of having to get agreements with each record label in each country. The US is somewhat progressive in this regards because has a law that sets one licensing rate and one organisation to pay it to (of course, there is still an ongoing dispute about what that rate should be). Not very many countries have similar provisions in their laws. I quote from the email that Pandora sent to its UK listeners - ” Both the PPL (which represents the record labels) and the MCPS/PRS Alliance (which represents music publishers) have demanded per track performance minima rates which are far too high to allow ad supported radio to operate”

This isn’t about the RIAA (at least not directly, I suppose) but about the UK rights organisations. Licensing (for streaming music at least) is regulated where the listener is, not where the sending business is located.

I think that Pandora blocked other countries in part, because of the difficulty of having to get agreements with each record label in each country. The US is somewhat progressive in this regards because has a law that sets one licensing rate and one organisation to pay it to (of course, there is still an ongoing dispute about what that rate should be). Not very many countries have similar provisions in their laws.

]]> By: Chris Thornett http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1907133 Chris Thornett Tue, 08 Jan 2008 17:17:12 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1907133 Incidentally, the reason Last.fm is still going strong is that it's owned by CBS and has licensing contracts with all the major labels, so they can play their artists. But then the reason you probably listen to Pandora is to hear artists you've not heard of before. Last.fm will still have to pay the PPL at some point for all the time they've been in business though and that's got to be millions of pounds by now. Incidentally, the reason Last.fm is still going strong is that it’s owned by CBS and has licensing contracts with all the major labels, so they can play their artists. But then the reason you probably listen to Pandora is to hear artists you’ve not heard of before.

Last.fm will still have to pay the PPL at some point for all the time they’ve been in business though and that’s got to be millions of pounds by now.

]]> By: Chris Thornett http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1907104 Chris Thornett Tue, 08 Jan 2008 17:05:48 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1907104 Sorry to correct you, but this isn't about the RIAA really. Sure, Pandora is fighting them, but this is specifically about the UK licensing required for Pandora to offer its service to UK listeners. The MCPS-PRS licensing body has some, well, just odd terms for large-scale webcasting services, like Pandora. It charges EITHER 6.5% of gross revenue OR £0.00085p per song, per user - whichever is HIGHER. Pandora plays a lot of music and currently has over 10 million users (not all in the UK admittedly, but believe me we love it over here!). Tim did the maths and realised that the cost of paying the MCPS-PRS was going to be about 45% of the UK operation's gross revenue. It doesn't end there though. Another body, The PPL collects performer fees in the UK, while the MCPS-PRS (what a terrible name) only collects the mechanical and lyrical fees. The PPL hasn't decided what to charge Pandora's kind of service yet, so Tim's estimate of 45% of gross revenue is even BEFORE the further PPL cut. There is a petition to the UK government up and running at the No.10 website, so if you're a UK resident, please head there and sign it if you want to keep Pandora and other services like it. Link is http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/SaveNetRadioUK It's time to put some pressure on the music industry to sort this joke of a situation out. If we don't fight this, we'll lose great services like Pandora! Sorry to correct you, but this isn’t about the RIAA really. Sure, Pandora is fighting them, but this is specifically about the UK licensing required for Pandora to offer its service to UK listeners.

The MCPS-PRS licensing body has some, well, just odd terms for large-scale webcasting services, like Pandora. It charges EITHER 6.5% of gross revenue OR £0.00085p per song, per user - whichever is HIGHER.

Pandora plays a lot of music and currently has over 10 million users (not all in the UK admittedly, but believe me we love it over here!). Tim did the maths and realised that the cost of paying the MCPS-PRS was going to be about 45% of the UK operation’s gross revenue.

It doesn’t end there though. Another body, The PPL collects performer fees in the UK, while the MCPS-PRS (what a terrible name) only collects the mechanical and lyrical fees.

The PPL hasn’t decided what to charge Pandora’s kind of service yet, so Tim’s estimate of 45% of gross revenue is even BEFORE the further PPL cut.

There is a petition to the UK government up and running at the No.10 website, so if you’re a UK resident, please head there and sign it if you want to keep Pandora and other services like it. Link is http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/SaveNetRadioUK

It’s time to put some pressure on the music industry to sort this joke of a situation out. If we don’t fight this, we’ll lose great services like Pandora!

]]> By: Chris http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1905921 Chris Tue, 08 Jan 2008 11:06:38 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1905921 How depressing. Such a great music service blocked with seemingly no regard to common sense. Pandora was responsible for so many (and I mean hundreds of tracks) of my music purchases of primarily American artisits from eMusic & Itunes in 2007 that I find it shocking that what is essentially free advertising in a music-mad country has been terminated. My dear hope for 2008 is that Amazon buys Pandora and that it re-launches it, along with it's DRM-free music shop, into the UK as soon as possible! How depressing. Such a great music service blocked with seemingly no regard to common sense.

Pandora was responsible for so many (and I mean hundreds of tracks) of my music purchases of primarily American artisits from eMusic & Itunes in 2007 that I find it shocking that what is essentially free advertising in a music-mad country has been terminated.

My dear hope for 2008 is that Amazon buys Pandora and that it re-launches it, along with it’s DRM-free music shop, into the UK as soon as possible!

]]> By: mike bartlett http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1905868 mike bartlett Tue, 08 Jan 2008 10:49:34 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1905868 This is just sheer stupidity from the RIAA. On Friday night I decided that it had been too long since I bought some good new music and so I settled down in front of my MacBook with a glass of wine and got stuck in. I knew of a few albums I wanted to buy, and so went ahead and bought Reverend and the Makers - The State of Things. I then put that into Pandora and it spat out a group called Young Love, I previewed the tracks in iTunes and within a few minutes I had bought that. By the end of the evening I had bought around 10 albums, 6 of these were probably based on Pandora recommendations. I'm sure others do the same, but that's fine. Remove gun from holster, aim at shoe, pull trigger. (P.S. If you haven't listened to Reverend and the Makers, you should do so. Great blend of Indie Rock with some electro and techno influences) This is just sheer stupidity from the RIAA. On Friday night I decided that it had been too long since I bought some good new music and so I settled down in front of my MacBook with a glass of wine and got stuck in.

I knew of a few albums I wanted to buy, and so went ahead and bought Reverend and the Makers - The State of Things. I then put that into Pandora and it spat out a group called Young Love, I previewed the tracks in iTunes and within a few minutes I had bought that.

By the end of the evening I had bought around 10 albums, 6 of these were probably based on Pandora recommendations. I’m sure others do the same, but that’s fine. Remove gun from holster, aim at shoe, pull trigger.

(P.S. If you haven’t listened to Reverend and the Makers, you should do so. Great blend of Indie Rock with some electro and techno influences)

]]> By: Patrick http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1905534 Patrick Tue, 08 Jan 2008 09:08:07 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1905534 I received the email from them this morning. I suppose I'll have to go back to Last.fm, but it's just not as easy to get the variety I'd like from them. I understand that people can find change difficult, but I seem to be continually amazed at how the RIAA still seems to believe it can survive by trying maintain the status quo. Too bad Pandora doesn't just open an office here in the UK to handle their international streams. I received the email from them this morning. I suppose I’ll have to go back to Last.fm, but it’s just not as easy to get the variety I’d like from them.

I understand that people can find change difficult, but I seem to be continually amazed at how the RIAA still seems to believe it can survive by trying maintain the status quo.

Too bad Pandora doesn’t just open an office here in the UK to handle their international streams.

]]> By: needlegun http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1905156 needlegun Tue, 08 Jan 2008 07:16:33 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1905156 That's it... the RIAA are modelling themselves on the Black Knight in Monty Python's Holy Grail film! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2eMkth8FWno That’s it… the RIAA are modelling themselves on the Black Knight in Monty Python’s Holy Grail film!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2eMkth8FWno

]]> By: myplaylist.biz http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1905011 myplaylist.biz Tue, 08 Jan 2008 06:13:11 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1905011 good news for the other playlists sites though, project play play list gets 7 million hits a day. good news for the other playlists sites though,

project play play list gets 7 million hits a day.

]]> By: Duncan Riley http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1904925 Duncan Riley Tue, 08 Jan 2008 05:35:26 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1904925 browse/ Bluey you have to get the license in the country you operate from, not the country you want to broadcast to. Pandora is in the US so they need an international agreement with the RIAA (ie an American license) to broadcast to the UK and other places. Last.fm is based in the UK so they get an international license with the UK equivalent body (but not the RIAA), same way if I was to set up a company here in Australia to broadcast to the US, I'd need a local license that would allow me to broadcast/ stream to outside of Australia to the US or UK for example, not one from the RIAA. In some ways its dumb, but on the other hand when used properly its easier than say having to obtain multiple licenses in different countries. browse/ Bluey
you have to get the license in the country you operate from, not the country you want to broadcast to. Pandora is in the US so they need an international agreement with the RIAA (ie an American license) to broadcast to the UK and other places. Last.fm is based in the UK so they get an international license with the UK equivalent body (but not the RIAA), same way if I was to set up a company here in Australia to broadcast to the US, I’d need a local license that would allow me to broadcast/ stream to outside of Australia to the US or UK for example, not one from the RIAA. In some ways its dumb, but on the other hand when used properly its easier than say having to obtain multiple licenses in different countries.

]]> By: Mel http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1904904 Mel Tue, 08 Jan 2008 05:20:34 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1904904 What is the issue here? Is RIAA demanding buckets of gold before they allow music to be streamed from the US? Or was it something at the UK end? What is the issue here? Is RIAA demanding buckets of gold before they allow music to be streamed from the US? Or was it something at the UK end?

]]> By: Bluey http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1904903 Bluey Tue, 08 Jan 2008 05:20:24 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1904903 What did the RIAA have to do with the rights in the UK - surely this would be down to a UK collection agency such as the PRS or PPL? Are you just RIAA-bashing? What did the RIAA have to do with the rights in the UK - surely this would be down to a UK collection agency such as the PRS or PPL?

Are you just RIAA-bashing?

]]> By: browse http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1904870 browse Tue, 08 Jan 2008 05:07:00 +0000 http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/01/07/memo-to-uk-no-pandora-for-you/#comment-1904870 how, exactly, is the riaa involved if the US is the ONLY country that is easy to negotiate a license with? how, exactly, is the riaa involved if the US is the ONLY country that is easy to negotiate a license with?

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