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January 4, 2008

More Defections At Google

Erick Schonfeld

82 comments »

googleogo6.gifToday we learn of two more Googlers leaving the search giant: Kevin Fox, a UI designer who worked on Gmail, Google Calendar, and Google Reader, and Nathan Stoll, a product manager at Google News. Fox is going to an unnamed startup. Stoll is vague about his plans. Update: Add New York sales vet David Hirsch to today’s list.

Remember, these are two three employees out of 16,000 and the end of the year is a natural time to leave a job for something else. But Fox and Stoll join a growing trickle of Google veterans who no longer find Google as alluring a place to work as they once did.

Anyone know what Google’s employee churn rate was in 2007? Anyone want to guess what it will be in 2008?

  • Sphere It

This entry was posted on Friday, January 4th, 2008 at 9:29 am and is filed under Company & Product Profiles. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. Both comments and pings are currently closed.

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  1. Sam

    January 4th, 2008 at 9:32 am

    Wow. I’ll bet the amount of good Google employees will fall.

  2. TheGeek

    January 4th, 2008 at 9:33 am

    Do you think they are leaving because G is no more a fun place to work, it could be the vitamin M too.

  3. Jurado

    January 4th, 2008 at 9:37 am

    Wow… and to think they added Andale Mexican food to the menu!!!

  4. Allen Stern

    January 4th, 2008 at 9:38 am

    Erick - I’d say that people leave a company for a large number of reasons OTHER than because they aren’t happy at their former employer.

    I’d also bet that churn will lower as people don’t get the options they did years ago.

  5. TekWek

    January 4th, 2008 at 9:38 am

    wow so you guys are going to write a post about 16,000 of those departures…..can be useful on slow news days…..btw in other news 30 people quit Yahoo over the holidays…..and 15 from Microsoft

  6. Annie

    January 4th, 2008 at 9:38 am

    Wow. How can your spell checker miss “Googel Calendar”?!?

  7. Jeremy Wright

    January 4th, 2008 at 9:41 am

    I think everyone saw this coming. Less options, bigger company, more management layers, less fun… The first 5000 people in always leave. There are only about 10 of the original 5000 MS / IBM / Sun guys left at each company.

    So yeah, you’ll see a *lot* of non-senior-management folk leave Google. But you’ll see a lot of folk go to Google as well, cause it’s still Google.

  8. Allen Stern

    January 4th, 2008 at 9:51 am

    jeremy you sure it’s only 10? i’d bet its more :)

    i think today people see these startups as the new gold rush - they want in - and the youngens are heading to them instead of heading to a “normal” job as my generation did.

  9. Marzipan From Toledo

    January 4th, 2008 at 9:55 am

    Was this site named TechCrunch because GoogleCrunch was already taken?

    Get off the google horse, man!

    As for why they are leaving. Look at the stock price, how much more upside do you think there is? The ultimate value of a company is at the price it can make an exit. If nobody can afford to open the door for them to exit, then they’re stuck.

    That was the problem with Cisco back in 2001 when it hit a $500B market cap. Big deal, $500B, who can afford to buy them? Answer: absolutely nobody and with that you take a short position.

    A short position might be a little risky with Google because it still has some very modest upside, but the people that are leaving are not looking for modest. They are looking for that “Monster Exit” as this blog likes to call them.

  10. dave

    January 4th, 2008 at 10:09 am

    well, the ‘03 hires are vesting this year - that was the last year before headcount really blew up, so if you factor in the small percentage of total employees they represent (and discount the already turned-over), i’m guessing that turnover by the end of the upcoming year will be much higher than anticipated…perhaps over 10 percent..

    …and this speaks volumes to google pulling the plug on contract recruiters. my gut says that they are now shifting their attention toward retention strategies…

  11. Sean

    January 4th, 2008 at 10:14 am

    Wow, 2 employees are leaving Google. Oh no, something horrible must be going on there!!!!

    I bet by next month, the entire company will be in shambles and their stock price will be 2 cents. Because 2 employees are leaving!! That’s HUGE people!!!!!!!!!!

  12. xenbet

    January 4th, 2008 at 10:14 am

    This is pathetic . it is not a slow news day.

    Let me give you a good story for today ” Intel has pulled out of the $100 dollar laptop project ” now thats worth writing about , tell us more about it , why they pulled out , the outlook of the project etc etc.

    To TC writers - I have to questions for you ,

    1.Firstly how many tips do you guys get a day ??
    2.How the heck do I get a Techcrunch writing job ? as im sure I could do it.

    thanks

  13. Yasser

    January 4th, 2008 at 10:15 am

    I must admit that it does look a bit fishy that so many people are starting to quit and start their own companies. Might be that now they have the money to do it or something is happening inside Google.

  14. Mr. Obvious

    January 4th, 2008 at 10:35 am

    Maybe it’s just that their options have vested and they want out? this in no way sheds bad image on google part IMO

  15. shams

    January 4th, 2008 at 10:36 am

    That’s too bad when the experienced ones leave the company. That’s not a good news.

  16. Martin

    January 4th, 2008 at 10:39 am

    Since it might not be as easy as before to get options at google..

    Some people may leave to create their own company.. which in turn would be bought by google.. that’s an interesting way of making great money. And it certainly is easier since they know the culture and what part of what google is looking for.

    I’m sure it’s also easier for people that had high profile jobs at google to find financement.

    With a great idea, some *easy* cash .. and knowing the right people at google, it helps a startup :)

    Cheers!

  17. Wedding Photographers

    January 4th, 2008 at 10:43 am

    It isn’t really a big deal that they are leaving. In fact, they probably hope to create a startup that google will eventually buy and pay them alot of money for it.

    That’s what I’d do.

  18. No Surprise

    January 4th, 2008 at 10:45 am

    Who cares.

  19. Trae Dorn

    January 4th, 2008 at 10:47 am

    I was reading an article in either Time or Newsweek (I don’t remember which, and I occasionally pick up either) about how Google is actually built to have a high rate of churn, and they expect it.

    I think there was a quote saying something about how they hope people will start brilliant new startups that succeed… so Google can buy them.

  20. newssweb

    January 4th, 2008 at 10:50 am

    wow… that’s why newspapers would always remain number one choice for people’S source of information… at least there are news there, not on techcrunch anymore. Talk about technology and culture and social aspects man… Your readers are expecting food for thoughts!!!

  21. SVDaily

    January 4th, 2008 at 10:50 am

    Were they sick of the free food from the cafeterias??

  22. Beck

    January 4th, 2008 at 10:52 am

    Defections? Oh, I thought it said defecations.

  23. xenbet

    January 4th, 2008 at 10:59 am

    just wait till the story about google mafia comes out !! oh no , sorry weve already had that issue last week.

    Nothing so see here folks, move on now.

  24. xenbet

    January 4th, 2008 at 11:01 am

    we should all band together and start our own tech blog. If anyone wants to do it im in. Im more than happy to fund the hosting/domain costs.

    Just need afew people who can locate the new stories happening in the techworld and the breaking stories before other sites.

  25. Pranav Prakash

    January 4th, 2008 at 11:01 am

    Is there a possibility that Google is on the shoes of NURV from the movie Antitrust(2001). http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0218817/plotsummary

  26. Charles Polanco

    January 4th, 2008 at 11:04 am

    If I was a Google millionaire I would leave too. Not because I hate Google but dame it, am a millionaire now, I have that right.

  27. James

    January 4th, 2008 at 11:06 am

    No wonder..they left the company just because the found a better one. It’s that simple..

  28. Eric Engleman

    January 4th, 2008 at 11:08 am

    I am of mixed opinion.

    A. 2 people leaving Google is not news (unless the people are larry and sergey).
    B. It is interesting to see where smart people are going.

    I think events like this should be wrapped up on a weekly basis. It would be a regular column on Fridays. It would be a summary of who is going where. No commentary. Just soft news right before the weather report.

  29. Jason

    January 4th, 2008 at 11:12 am

    UI designer at Google. Isn’t that an oxymoron?

  30. pji

    January 4th, 2008 at 11:12 am

    Google UI designer? No, seriously, what was his real job? Everything Google does, however useful, looks like a n00b web page from the early 90s.

  31. Marc Duchesne

    January 4th, 2008 at 11:13 am

    I’m candidate for any replacement @ Google, folks ! ;-)

  32. Roupen

    January 4th, 2008 at 11:20 am

    The Gmail UI is amazingly simple - I’d love to work with the guy who designed it (who now has left)!

  33. xenbet

    January 4th, 2008 at 11:21 am

    love it , UI designer.

    ———-
    xenbet.com

  34. .rb

    January 4th, 2008 at 11:22 am

    Google is a hell of a place to work …

    - The grass is always greener on the other side…

    - this would only be an issue if they left for MS or IBM / ask or yahoo

  35. Annie

    January 4th, 2008 at 11:23 am

    pji @30, I guess you’ve never seen Google Analytics.

  36. King

    January 4th, 2008 at 11:27 am

    The Burger King I work at. Well, we lost one of our people too. He took care of flipping the patties and cutting up the onions. His name was Pat Ryan. Just thought I’d let you guys know.

  37. xenbet

    January 4th, 2008 at 11:30 am

    good tip #36 .

    ———
    http://www.xenbet.com

  38. Jurado

    January 4th, 2008 at 11:31 am

    Eric: Typo it’s defection not defacation….lol

  39. Gavin Schulz

    January 4th, 2008 at 11:41 am

    Wow if you are going to make news about 2 people leaving Google, than man your blog will be full of posts of companies were a few people quit. I wouldn’t exactly say these guys are “big” guys, big deal, a UI designer.

  40. pji

    January 4th, 2008 at 11:42 am

    Annie, I’ve seen Google Analytics and my statement still stands: Google UI design = No effort. They make things very simple but 100% no frills.

  41. Riley Poole

    January 4th, 2008 at 11:52 am

    Simple design doesn’t mean any effort. By that logic, Google might as well just use Notepad to design their front page and search results. Fact is even the simplest things have to be properly managed, tracked and support and even if it’s something as simple as a few pages, I imagine they have a full staff of people to support it.
    ———-
    http://www.merchanttalk.com/

  42. Chris L

    January 4th, 2008 at 12:08 pm

    Wow, it must be a slow news day. This story may say more about your lack of content and the decline of TC than google…

  43. Mick Liubinskas

    January 4th, 2008 at 12:17 pm

    Is it the same Kevin Fox that’s been working at MyOpenId on Pibb?

    http://www.tangler.com/people/id/5401
    http://jyte.com/profile/kfox.myopenid.com

    I guess not, but 2 Kevin Fox’s in tech is pretty coincidental.

  44. Marzipan From Toledo

    January 4th, 2008 at 12:33 pm

    Chris L .. do you know Chris R ?

  45. RYK

    January 4th, 2008 at 12:35 pm

    what a lame story, 2 junior guys leave out 16,000 and it makes for a sensational headline! I bet there are 2 guys leaving and 5 joining Google, Microsoft, IBM, Toyota every day

  46. Dan

    January 4th, 2008 at 12:35 pm

    it is just a matter of time
    Google isn’t as sexy as it used to be and kids do grow up.

  47. Andrew

    January 4th, 2008 at 12:36 pm

    Making things “very simple” isn’t nearly as easy as you think it is, pji.

  48. Chris L

    January 4th, 2008 at 1:04 pm

    No relation or affiliation to Chris R… Maybe they will do a story on that next?

  49. Penny Herscher

    January 4th, 2008 at 1:35 pm

    We’ve got a solution to this problem - we detect, store and report on management turnover in a beta version of the FirstRain product. Unannounced departures and internal moves are very revealing over time.

  50. Chuck Schick

    January 4th, 2008 at 1:55 pm

    I also heard that an admin and a junior project manager left Google as well. Time to short the stock.

  51. WetObserver

    January 4th, 2008 at 1:58 pm

    well?

  52. WannaBeShareHolder

    January 4th, 2008 at 2:00 pm

    I’m less concerned about the defections and more concerned about all the Google shareholders who must be asking themselves, “We pay for all those perks — the massages, the gourmet kitchen set, the bicycles, the buses — and in the end, employees are still bailing out. Hmmmm.”

  53. Cloverfield

    January 4th, 2008 at 2:48 pm

    I think people at TechCrunch get paid per post….so write any retarded shit and bill Arrington

  54. Cormac

    January 4th, 2008 at 3:00 pm

    Oh my god, two people have left a company of thousands!!! I’m literally running out the door to my nuclear fall out shelter as we speak..

    What’s going to be on TechCrunch tomorrow? Maybe you guys should cover what Steve Job’s farts smell like?

  55. spacetime

    January 4th, 2008 at 3:01 pm

    This isn’t news!!!!!!
    @wannabe…. yes, be very concerned about all the Google shareholders …blah blah blah $%^&*@##$%*&^% waste of space carbon sack of skin

  56. Nemrut

    January 4th, 2008 at 3:41 pm

    i always thought gmail, google calendar were overrated and not very intuitive. maybe this speaks to some of their emplyees as well…

  57. bigdaddy

    January 4th, 2008 at 4:34 pm

    Is this noteworthy? Not good when you already have the lamest article of the year on January 4th. They’ve been there a while, are probably absurdly rich, and are probably bored shitless.

    Happens pretty regulary (well, except the silly rich part, which probably makes the decision a whole lot easier).

  58. Scott

    January 4th, 2008 at 4:44 pm

    I’ve read that that many of the “perks” at Google are highly overrated. However, that’s just hearsay.

  59. Erick Schonfeld

    January 4th, 2008 at 7:31 pm

    Hmm, for a lame post there sure are a lot of comments.

    If you don’t like this one, we put out more than 15 other posts today. Go read those.

  60. Brandon Harrison

    January 4th, 2008 at 9:10 pm

    How is this news? ex-google people have never done anything. It’s not like they are ex-PayPal ;)

  61. Brandon Harrison

    January 4th, 2008 at 9:12 pm

    WHO CARES? REPORT REAL NEWS PLEASE

  62. Mantari

    January 4th, 2008 at 10:07 pm

    I was told by a Google employee that Google doesn’t interview the best and the brightest anymore, because they’ve already hired the best and brightest. The future must be very dark, indeed!

  63. UberInvestor.com

    January 4th, 2008 at 10:09 pm

    It happened at Microsoft and will happen at Google and any other hot startup. When recruiters start hunting for employees based on “who they know inside” than “what they are qualified to do” it becomes a turn off for good employees and good potential employees. Microsoft has been doing it. Google is doing it too. One might think that because of Google’s rising stock market valuation, everyone wants to work there (something which was thought about MSFT too). But the reality is that for good employees this is not the top priority, because they know wherever they go they will do well financially.

  64. David

    January 4th, 2008 at 10:53 pm

    Wow, as a Google employee I can’t believe how one-sided your explanation here is. Have you heard of stock options? Well all companies with stellar stock experience defections after their early employees vest…

  65. Michael T. Halligan

    January 5th, 2008 at 12:07 am

    Given the sad excuse for a UI that is Google Calendar, this is not much of a loss.

  66. If a pm quits in a forest

    January 5th, 2008 at 1:04 am

    … does it make a sound?

    PMs are the lowest from of life in a tech company. I bet only the HR dept noticed these guys were gone.

  67. larf

    January 5th, 2008 at 3:19 am

    This totally matters!

    Seriously you guys shut up so I can hear what he is saying!

  68. Oo

    January 5th, 2008 at 3:49 am

    :O Pity, I thought working at Google would rock. Well, some seem to think it doesn’t. I like the google apps but most of them I wont use because I’d rather just use Word instead of google docs, or so the battle seems even, openoffice, why? It’s just more comfortable.

  69. Billco

    January 5th, 2008 at 8:02 am

    Calling these “defections” is baseless fear-mongering. People don’t stick around the same job for 50 years anymore, there’s more to life than a steady paycheck. These guys have made their money at Google, and now they’re going to try different things. If there were something really wrong with Google, we wouldn’t be hearing about 2-3 management guys leaving, it would be hundreds of staff of all ranks quitting in droves.

  70. Steel

    January 5th, 2008 at 9:20 am

    I think if you look around all the names that left Google, some have been key personnel in certain areas. People looking for greener grass is not a big deal in the big scheme, however, sometimes key people peak and then get into a rut doing the same thing day after day and for sanity sake need to move on.

  71. bill

    January 5th, 2008 at 7:05 pm

    I’m sure they are great people. However, I think Google could use a new UI designer for gmail. Gmail is user hostile compared to Hotmail and Yahoo.

  72. Narendra

    January 5th, 2008 at 11:03 pm

    Unless it is a disgruntled startup (e.g. Dodgeball), or a VP or above, people leaving Google is not news.

  73. Allan

    January 6th, 2008 at 3:38 am

    Wow.. looks like the most “fun” place to work for geeks is starting to get lame..

    yea.. the quot marks are intentional.. not a geek.. xD

  74. Ree Tanjuatco

    January 7th, 2008 at 1:52 am

    This isn’t news. This is a natural succession of a growing corporation. It’s like hair, you grow some and lose some… well until you get bald…

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