December 17, 2007

A Few Thoughts On Google Knol

Michael Arrington

89 comments »

News of Google most recent project, Knol, came out late last Thursday without, as far as I can tell, much in the way of press pre-briefings. All the major publications were late to the story. Blogs hit it fast, but had nothing to go on other than the brief blog post put up by Google’s Udi Manber announcing the project. Our initial story on Knol is here.

From a product perspective, Knol is not much different than existing products like Squidoo and Hubpages. It’s a new knowledge base for authors. Anyone, eventually, will be able to write on any topic they choose. Google will provide authoring tools, store the information, allow others to comment and suggest edits, add ads with the author’s approval, and provide traffic via their search engine.

But Knol isn’t really aimed at Squidoo and Hubpages. It’s much more likely that Google is jealously eyeing the massive traffic that flows through its search engine to Wikipedia. As Nick Carr has noted, Wikipedia continues to climb and climb in search results for many top search terms.

More Ad Inventory Needed, ASAP

Wikipedia, a non-profit, has stubbornly resisted any efforts to monetize its pages. Google would kill to supply ads to Wikipedia. Barring that, competing with them makes a lot of sense.

Google needs to grow revenue to support their valuation. And for that, they need ad inventory. It wasn’t surprising when Google started hosting news directly and allowing comments (that = page views). So the idea of them hosting a knowledge base shouldn’t be surprising, either.

Authors have a choice - they can have ads or not. But if they have ads, they can only choose Google. Many authors are going to include ads, and Google will get extra inventory.

Delicious Timing

Wikipedia has caused more problems than just refusing to take Google’s ads. They are also launching a much anticipated search engine this month via their for-profit arm, Wikia (Wikipedia founder Jimmy Wales hates it when Wikia is called that, but it’s damned hard to tell where Wikipedia ends and Wikia begins sometimes). Google isn’t likely to be particularly scared of Wikia’s new search engine, but it has probably been a little annoying for them to watch all the press about the upcoming “Google Killer.”

Google doesn’t usually pre-announce products before launch. in this case they did. Why? Perhaps as a reminder to Wikipedia that competition can flow both ways.

Anyone Remember Google Base?

As a content management system, Knol is a kissing cousin to Google Base, a classified ad platform that Google launched in late 2005. Google Base has gone exactly nowhere - if anything it’s a spam farm and nothing more. But at the time of its launch the New York Times and others heralded it as a major disruptive force to the classified ads world. Knol may be Google Base with a little more strategic thought applied.

No Conflicts Here, Move Along

Google says that Knol pages will be indexed into their search engine but will have no special ranking. That’s a little bit untrue, since they’ll be hosted by Google and will have the advantage of Google’s hefty PageRank to lift them in search results. And since no one will be auditing Google to ensure that Knol pages are treated just like everyone else, there are bound to be claims of conflict of interest. The fact is, Google will make money from Knol, and so they’ll have a financial interest in moving people to those pages. That makes them less believable in the role of a neutral gatekeeper.

Google is now synonymous with search. Offering Google Knol and putting it in the search results is analogous to Microsoft offering Office for the Windows platform. Sure, anyone can compete with Office, but Microsoft has a natural advantage and finds ways of keeping market share. The Knol team will likely do the same over time.

Wikipedia v. Knol

Wikipedia gets massive support from the community because it’s non-profit. Google can’t compete with that, so they’re focusing on putting the authors’ names in lights and giving them a little cash on the side, too. That should help them pull some heavy Wikipedia contributors over to their project.

Very soon we are going to see a lot of Wikipedia content moving wholesale to Knol. Wikipedia content is basically free to use, redistribute, copy, whatever, under the GNU license:

All text in Wikipedia is covered by GNU Free Documentation License (GFDL), a copyleft license permitting the redistribution, creation of derivative works, and commercial use of content while authors retain copyright of their work.

Anyone writing for Knol is likely to at least peruse Wikipedia content before publishing. And if they see anything good, they are at liberty to simply lift and copy it over to Knol, and get a adsense check for their time.

So, in a way, Google has found a way to monetize Wikipedia content after all.

In a poll on Friday
, TechCrunch readers narrowly said Google hasn’t overstepped its boundaries with Knol. If Knol is a success, those results may be a little different a year from now. In fact, the more successful Knol is, the more uncomfortable people are going to be with Google as gatekeeper and content provider.

  • Sphere It

Trackbacks/Pings (Trackback URL)

  1. A Few Thoughts On Google Knol  »TechAddress
  2. New information technologies for the friends of prediction markets? | Midas Oracle .ORG
  3. Knol Roll Network Blog
  4. Apogee Weblog | Google Knol Second Thoughts
  5. Dave Liu dot com / musings from the edge » Articles of the Day
  6. Today’s Curiousities at the lay enthusiast
  7. Google brengt met Knol variant van Wikipedia « CDM at work
  8. » We-Think, therefore we are

Comments

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  1. YDRIVE

    MA absolutely correct.. in the past when i wanted to find something, i’ll google. More recently, i both google, and wikipedia. In fact, a lot of times, wikipedia gave more pertinent and more in-depth answers, but the google sniplets are sprankled all over and hard to spot the authoritative link on a subject, /ac.

  2. Jon

    I am anxious to see how long it takes google to remove all the wikipedia references in google earth.

    Jon

  3. Thomas

    Any thoughts on spam prevention?

  4. Tom Stone

    Great write-up, this is what TC is all about.

    Knol won’t be the death of Wikipedia nor will it be a complete fork but there will be many people who will simply sync Knol with Wikipedia to get the revenue.

    However, this could also mean that Knol will contain multiple copies of the same pages.

    Find the most popular pages on Wikipedia, copy them to Knol. The CTRL-C business model.

    …or Wikipedia could change their licensing.

  5. Personal Development Blog

    Google really wants in on everything. I’m not surprised but since they are such a strong company with powerful backing, they may just give wikipedia a run for their zeros….

  6. Small Business Marketing

    At the core of knowledge is the ‘validity’ of information. It remains to be seenn how google will validate information stored in its knowledge base. Thomas’ concern about spam is very relevant. Anyone will have the capability to put any information out there

  7. K.Kaviraj

    Yup I do see valid and good points put forth by Mike . But there is one permanent question in my mind …… Ive always seen Techcrunch people ( Espcially Mike ;-) ) write blogs directly impacting Google . May we ( as readers of Techcrunch :-) ) know the little strory behind Mike’s hatred towards Google ?????? or is it a way of writing - like criticise/blog something smoking on a BIG SHOT and attract more crowd towards the news ??? :-) …. please throw some light on my question Mike :-)

  8. Juice

    Kaviraj: I think Mike and Duncan are playing “good cop, bad cop” thing here, Duncan will always write some stories about Google from positive side, and then Mike will opposite that. :)

  9. YDRIVE

    Google might have expanded inventory of pageviews.. but there are subjects that have no advertisers.. eg., recently OpenID is a hot topic.. but interestly, no advertisers buy on the openid keyword?? (or rather, google choosing not render the ads regardless of what keyword the advertisers buy?)

    Eg., today, a search on openid (just as one of the many examples) shows no sponsor ads (well, at least on my page.. you’re welcome to tell to the contrary:
    http://www.google.com.hk/search?q=openid

  10. techman

    Google is after $580 million ad revenue that gets generated from Wiki. Google is just a corp like msft and aapl.

  11. leafar

    i want to opt-in google ads in my wikipedia.
    I don’t donate, but i spend so much time on this website….

    Open Wikipedia for those who wants… make money … increase resources (and maybe pay a high salary to jimmy so he stops wikia ;-D)

  12. Seth Finkelstein

    Regarding “That’s a little bit untrue, since they’ll be hosted by Google and will have the advantage of Google’s hefty PageRank to lift them in search results.”

    That’s not necessarily correct - if it’s on a different subdomain, there’s no PageRank -type benefit. Just like all the blogging platforms (blogger/blogspot/typepad/wordpress, etc).

    Note also that Google own Blogger, but there’s no indication that Blogger benefits in search results from that ownership.

  13. micfo.com

    Will they accept external links for references, like wikipedia?

  14. DC

    Every time I hear of Google getting into yet another market I am reminded of how powerful this company is—and how they’ve really tricked the entire world. They are hoisted as an example of developing a free service for the masses and then finding a way to make money on it. They are touted as the centralized repository of the world’s best programmers, who’ve melded together in the name of better, open source code, stock options, and free food. But they’ve tricked us all into thinking that they we should share all we’ve created in the hopes of building a better future for all developers. Long Live Google Code!

    But where is the open source on Google Search? Where are the algorithms that make PageRank index so well? Why can’t we have access to these recipes that will help us all make better searching tools, and perhaps make the world even easier to index and search? Google isn’t even about to share their formula for success, but they’ll gladly host your code in exhange for reading every single line of it with the license to use any of it at will.

    If many say Google is the poster boy for open source, then I must be crazy because I say they are the poster boy CLOSED SOURCE. They make their money ($$$ - this stuff counts) off of search. That code is kept top secret (the fact that this also prevents gaming the system is a happy coincidence and excuse). Then in return they have opened up a variety of tools that encourage us all to share our platforms, javascript libraries and methodology for the world to see. The result is while everyone else is a good citizen in the open source land, Google remains protective of most of the logic that would make searching anything more efficient.

    The point? If you hold Google up as the company you admire, then keep your brilliant code close to you and figure out a way to win with it. If you want to truly embrace open source, just understand that if your idea is not just a feature then you’re not just giving good code away to your fellow hackers, but also to a multi-billion dollar company that will try and crush anything open source (Wikipedia) that impacts the revenue from its closed source search product.

  15. Chris in Sweden

    Isn’t Knol going to attract money-making schemers to write low-quality content for Knol, just to get listed, generate traffic, and ad clicks? Who will want to read that content then? Who will trust it, if it is being written for profit?

    No doubt it must be frustrating for Google to see Wikipedia sitting there, refusing to carry ads, and moving into the Top 10 web sites globally, but the editors at Wikipedia are happy to write and contribute for no compensation. The notion that those writers will leave Wikipedia for Knol isn’t believable to me.

    I suspect that 1 year from now Knol will be in the graveyard.

  16. Parul Bindra

    One of the last times Google tried to get together a group of experts around the world for a project of theirs was for Google Answers, a paid Q&A service that has been canceled in the meantime. Lets see how Knol fares.

    Parul
    http://www.bhopu.com

  17. John

    my twopennyworth: As google is synonymous for search, surely wikipaedia is so for the on-line encyclopaedia. I suggest that it is now too firmly entrenched in the publics minds as the place to go for detailed explanation, to worry about what Google is doing. My daughter referenced it at Uni, my son at grammar school and I in most research. It of course must not be seen as gospel but it is an excellent start point. Its beauty and danger apart form any-one being able to add an article, is that anyone can also challenge and amend an article. How does that impact the Google Knol model, in this case who owns the article and thus who owns the ad revenue?

    I also suggest that many of the Google extra products are not that good, poorly thought through and badly designed (eg: the horrible googlemail) , and there are usually many better open source / free competitors.

    We should stop trembling with fear every time Google sticks its big toe in a in a puddle or a pond. It can also stub it or get bitten.

  18. Sascha

    Copying Wikipedia content to Knol (and vice versa) would not be possible, since the GNU Free Documentation License isn’t compatible with any of the CC licences - as far as I understand.

  19. Seth Finkelstein

    Wikipedia is trying to move to a CC-compatible license.

  20. JeffC

    Great analysis on this. I had not thought of the transfer of info from Wikipedia to Knols, and thus monetizing Wikipedia in a back door sort of way. I”m just wondering what options Wikipedia is considering behind closed doors right now. If it were to suddenly turn for-profit, and allow a competing ad network on its pages (MSN, Yahoo) … would that be a good counter punch? Would contributors really abandon Wikipedia if it were suddenly for-profit, or would they gladly stay on board, happy to help Wikipedia thrive, and share some revenue along the way?

  21. gokcen

    google wants everything, like a spoilt child.
    whenever a (internet) business develops, sooner or later google buys it or copies it, but never allows co-existence.
    soon they’re going to acquire internet itself :)

  22. jamie

    DC (point 14) - i’m with you. Everyone (well perhaps not everyone, but a lot of people) seem to view google with rose tinted glasses.

    I just don’t get it. They (google) bang on about open source software, but they don’t provide better / some access to their developments - it really does feel like a one way street. At least with Microsoft you know where you stand - you either buy into that or you don’t. Google is trying to ride two horses here at the same time and hope no one notices (or cares for that matter).

    If google were so concerned about provided great knowledge and content on the web that they should set a Knol style operatin up away from the main google machine - i.e. as a separate entity - with a properly defined set of principles/ownership. It would provide for greater transparency and probably allow for greater levels of contribution.

    However, i suspect that they don’t actually care about creating great and relevant content - they want to drive their advertising revenues . Whether it be through new outlets (knol) or via even more entries on their search engine results

  23. YDRIVE

    On tricking the entire world, there’s almost always this foul-you strategy..
    if people remember alternet (operated by uunet) in the late 80’s early 90’s
    when there was only arpanet plus nsfnet, alternet always advertising
    themselves as operating on cost-recovery basis.. and suddenly almost
    overnight, they will tell you, we’re going public next month, which they did.

    And say, Mozilla. Open source, non-profit, etc etc., and enthusiasts rushing
    to raise hundres of thousands from supporters to advertise full page on
    was that NYT to “download a better browser”… suddenly, “the Mozilla
    foundation” found themselves $60M adsense revenue, and still thought
    they could do better (and they will do better)… who’s been tricking? and
    who are tricked? and who supported the tricks?… Do you feel tricked?

    Re PageRank (patent assigned to Stanford).. while no source code, the
    (patented) methodologies are publicly made available (per patenting)..
    but it’s not really the source code itself, but their infrastructure (and
    the founders perseverence in their beliefs) that made google what they
    are today.. (and for this, they deserve their success.) After all, they did
    publish their BigTable methods (albeit not in fine details..) but there’s
    open-source implementation of the map-reduce methodology which
    arguably could be a basis for all google-wannabe’s to play with :-D

    But what really makes them from a $100M company to a $200B company
    in shortly a few years, isn’t really about open-source codes copy & paste,
    or at least it doesn’t seem so.. if tricking methods are not some secret
    sauce, why can’t all those many fine corporations and/or gifted individuals
    reproduce the google success story…

  24. YDRIVE

    >On tricking the entire world, there’s almost always this foul-you strategy..
    typo, meant of, fool-you strategy..

  25. DC

    YDRIVE - I wasn’t knocking the brilliance of the Google Founders, who saw search as the key to the Web. I’m knocking the fact that in your post you twice mentioned two things that Google is “doing” but then added the caveats (ohhhhh it’s patented…..ohhhhh without the fine details). JQuery is a brilliant Javascript Library. I don’t think there’s a patent. And the details are out there for you to use—heck—it’s a ready made library that is helping us all make better products.

    As for your thoughts on Mozilla and alternet—my point exactly. As for Wordpress potentially being bought—my point exactly. As for Moveable Type—which as Arrington said is looking to get bought—they will most certainly benefit from open source. You’ll make their product even better for free until it’s so good they can sell the “open source” project to a company for hundreds of millions of dollars.

    But hey—we’ll still be able to submit our patches. I don’t mention movies often, but if you saw “Live Free or Die Hard” you’ll recall what happened to the hackers after they did their job. Metaphorically speaking, the young hackers out there are getting a very similar shaft.

    Does anyone else see this scam?

  26. MR

    Wiki should get on the phone with Yahoo.

  27. YDRIVE

    @DC - yes I’m with you. My later and major [caveat’ed] point though was that
    google’s success per se did not quite stem from open-source being its core.

  28. Danny Sullivan

    I believe we were the only publication prebriefed and had more than just a summary of what was on the blog post: http://searchengineland.com/071213-213400.php. In particular, I noted that Google did NOT rule out the idea that ads could be on these pages from providers other than Google (though I also doubt they’d really go through with that).

    Completely disagree that Know and Google Base are kissing cousins. Google Base is for structure, delimited data. And to say it has gone nowhere means you’re mistakenly viewing Base as a consumer-oriented product. It is a publisher tool for dumping data into Google, used by thousands of online merchants not to mention real estate agents and others.

  29. Matt M

    Will the links in the Knol articles have “nofollow” added like wikipedia?

  30. J.P.

    This is why I read you Michael, great analysis.

    Thanks.

  31. Permeate

    Enlightening article Michael, but you’re wrong about Google Base. It’s much more than a spammy classified ad program - it powers all the merchant product feeds, including the ones you see at the top of regular search results. This is very important for online merchants such as myself.

  32. Tony Casson

    Very insightful. The wikipedia/wikia relationship is very interesting. One of your points is that Google may be trying to monetize Wikipedia through Knol and Wikipedia through Wikia (very indirectly wink, wink, nudge, nudge). However, if a massive non-profit site that is pervasive in our lives were suddenly to start “organically” pushing people toward a clearly associated for-profit site, in a manner that appeared to be somewhat less than random, the DoJ might have something to say about it under Antitrust provisions. Google has no such problem being a competitor to Wikipedia. Anyone know the history of non-profit companies with an associated for-profit organization using market power to help capitalize the for-profit entity?

  33. Jim

    Great entry! You should write this type of general analysis more often.

    The lack of any license discussion in the Google Blog post seemed very glaring considering the topic. I think this is a project where we’ll really see some friction in Google: will they offer CC licenses for the authors? The GDFL? Try to bury the whole issue?

    A year from now we might be saying that this was when Google lost the respect of the Open Source community.

  34. ITrush

    Sometimes an overwhelming desire to have more can be very risky, it might kill you!

    Nhick
    http://www.itrush.com

  35. Danny Sullivan

    Right now, Google tells me the links will NOT be nofollow, though that could change. Indeed, I expect it will.

  36. David Litsky

    1. Google gets greedy
    2. Google tries to buy / copy everything on the internet
    3. Google loses focus of how it became what it is today
    4. Google starts to see its growth slow
    5. Shareholders get trigger happy and Google loses a chunk of its valuation

  37. Jarrod

    anyone have an idea when Knoll is supposed to be released?

  38. Permeate

    @17 John -

    LOL. You think Gmail is poorly designed? You just lost all credibility.

  39. Al C

    Anyone have any thoughts on the possibility of using KNOL internally by companies for knowledge sharing. It looks like a great way for internal subject mater experts to get their information out on an internet and make it easy for others to find and benefit from?

  40. bart

    Re: #38

    AHAHA, as soon as I read that he said gmail is no good, I thought the same thing.

  41. John

    38 & 40
    This is not for this blog but I am quite happy to argue the poor googlemail gui with anyone, with or without my credibility - and it is not the only poorly designed google product - but that is not for now.

    cheers and smiles

  42. David

    I am too timecrunched to read all the comments here, so I may be repeating. I think you have to look at ALL of Google’s actions through the lens of Game Theory. I am not so sure that Google really wants to launch Knol and see it track towards being successful. What I think they are signaling to Wikipedia and others is that they have the option to compete and to do so with enormous competitive advantage. GoogleBase, GoogleCheckout, Knol–In a startup, these are product lines that must generate revenue. For Google, they are really big, un-ignorable asterisks in negotiating and partnering discussions. Remember the classic example of the retailer who advertises that they will match any competitor’s sale price? Success isn’t measured by “matched sale prices.” Success is measured by talking down the competition from engaging in price cutting in the first place. Similarly, the success of Knol is not going to be based on page views and revenues inside Knol but on how such an announcement shapes the competitive environment for Google outside Knol.

  43. Andy Gongea

    Excellent article.

    I really do think that Google’s slogan “Don’t be evil” was incomplete. Or at least it was referring to all other players except for Google. I believe that knol will not be a hit.
    I bet all my money on Wikipedia and Wikia and Amazon for 2008.

  44. Dan Blacharski

    The very concept of having a web site (Wikipedia) that publishes information written by committee–and worse yet, an anonymous committee–is one of the worst ideas I’ve ever seen. As I posted in my entry on the topic (http://thenextdotcomboom.com/?p=11), Google’s got the right idea with Knol. Author real names are listed–there’s the accountability that Wikipedia lacks. And once and for all, the argument that Wikipedia is somehow superior because they don’t make money just doesn’t hold water.

  45. Shams

    Let’s wait for the new search engine and how it affects others. That will be interesting.

  46. YDRIVE

    On DC’s ref of “..open source (Wikipedia)..” and Google’s not reciprocating
    by open-sourcing its search code…

    I think for this discussion we need to disambiguate among the terms of
    “open source” vs. “open data” (vs. “open standards”, “open access”, etc.)

    Given that, I don’t think Wikipedia success was particularly dependent on
    it’s open source software, nor Google’s huge success particularly
    resulted from other people’s open source software.. henceforth
    I ain’t quit knocking Google’s not open-sourcing their search software..
    (despite myself a long-time open-source fan and believer always…)

    In fact, I’d tend to think, Wikipedia’s one major success factor has been
    from its relatively “free format”… which would not scare away the general
    users to contribute.. it’s more like the taxanomy vs. folksnomy (ie., tags)
    case in the rise of web2.0 (getting users to participate).. haven’t seen the
    site yet, but based on that INSOMNIA screenshot, KNOL articles seem
    “too professional”.. compared with http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insomnia

    But well, if that’s just a smokescreen and expecting people just copy &
    paste from Wikipedia.. then.. perhaps.. worth a try [for Google]… :-D /ac.

  47. Permeate

    @41 - If we took a poll right now, I guarantee you are the only reader who thinks Gmail (or, “Googlemail” for you) is a poorly designed product. If you have a hard time with the GUI then you must be mentally handicapped.

  48. YDRIVE

    >users to contribute.. it’s more like the taxanomy vs. folksnomy (ie., tags)
    users to contribute.. it’s more like the taxonomy vs. folksonomy (ie., tags)
    sorry typo..

  49. Perry Mizota

    When talking about Knol, I guess it’s impossible to avoid the “Wikipedia competitor” angle but I think the interesting thing about Knol (and Squidoo and HubPages) is the focus on the author, rather than just the content (like with Wikipedia). I think the author-centric orientation will be an enabler to what I call “knowledge networking”. More of my thoughts can be found at http://abovethenoise.blogspot......tive.html.

  50. John

    47
    I find your comment offensive. I did not say I had a hard time with it I said I didnt like it - I think it is badly designed from a GUI perspective - I find Thunderbird well designed for me. I am allowed to think that. There is no need to insult me like that.

  51. Permeate

    Ok, well I still think you’re an idiot. I don’t really care if I hurt your feelings or not.

  52. John

    Permeate: How old are you? Does your mother know you are on the computer you argue like a kid in kindergarten.
    If this thread were to do with Gmail / Googlemail then I would explain where I think the GUI doesnt work well. However I believe that Google often rushes stuff out to get a presence and worries about the design and user acceptance later if at all. I am not anti Google but I think it lets them down.

  53. =)

    good article MA. this is what worthy for me coming back.

  54. Steve

    Hey.
    I wrote something similar to my blog.
    Cool!
    http://www.pccomic.com

  55. I Am Not Posting To Spam My Blog

    The thing about competing with Wikipedia is that competing with a non-profit is extremely hard to get to grips with. As I’ve said before, Wikipedia’s non-profit status is part of what holds it back - it lacks any drive to improve its articles apart from for Jimbo Wales to improve his self-image.

    If people did stop reading Wikipedia, then would Wikipedians care? Probably not. They’d lose donations, but they’d also have less strain on their servers, and since the fanatical editors, not the casual readers, are almost certainly the biggest donors, it would either balance out or work out in their favour. That may sound like a funny way to view losing readers, but the entire time I was an admin there, I never once heard readers or anything like that mentioned as a measure of success. Success was always measured in terms of articles written (either overall or those that met the Good or Featured Article criteria).

    So while Knol may flourish or wither (as other Wikipedia alternatives have), I don’t think it will have a direct effect on Wikipedia. This is unlikely to be of interest to journalists and pretend journalists, though, who are obsessed with presenting any sort of competition as they do a football game.

    Meanwhile we have to put up with the same old tired complaints about how Wikipedia is completely useless and if Wikipedia says 2 + 2 = 4, then it must be 5. People hate Wikipedia’s open editing model, but what they hate even more is that it works. It’s not perfect, but it’s produced an encyclopaedia that is entirely usable in most respects.

  56. MikeM

    Google should just strike a deal with Wales to invest in Wikia. My “informal” research and contact with school aged kids shows me they prefer Wikipedia to Google. Google knows this.
    These kids grow up and are the search consumers of the future.

    Once Wales builds out their new search engine/site these kids will migrate there naturally. One thing is certain, no 15 year old will consult Knol, period.
    Not cool, it’s corporate, Google used to be anti-corporate, they know the sentiment.
    Knol will be a success as long as their authors are paid well. If not then it will fail. Take Blogger as an example, how many Blogger blogs make a dime from AdSense? Not many in proportion.
    If Knol authors are not rewarded the experiment will fail.
    Google, go to Wales with 2 bil., support Wikipedia Foundation, support their websearch initiative and buy this problem out.
    Personally I would like nothing more than to see Jimbo Wales kick some Google butt however Google could end this threat with hard cash. I would not blame Wales for cashing in either.

  57. ss

    @43

    Amazon looks like the real visionary alpha-male out there, with the roll out of
    S3, EC2, FPS, simple DB etc.

    Goog the former alpha-male, is now reduced to a game-theory munching
    political machine forming alliances etc, not really making real innovations
    anymore

  58. Knol is diffferent than Wikipedia

    Wikipedia is great, I use it all the time. Knol escaping a comparison to wikipedia is not possible, but I think Knol will serve a different purpose:

    1) The author *controls* the page and CAN share in revenue (doesn’t have to have adsense according to google blog). If the page sucks, users will rate it low and nobody will link to it. Someone else will create a different page for the same topic and get all the traffic.

    2) Google could place Knol results in a special spot (i.e. the right column) separate from the organic results.

    Anyone that thinks google would shoot themselves in the foot and utilize their position as the search leader for some measly amount of revenue from adsense on info pages has not thought this through very well. They dont have a +$200B mkt cap for nothing.

  59. Adrian

    IMHO Know has the potential of being even better than Wikipedia. Why’s that? Because it’s for profit.
    It all depends of the inner system used by Knol to rank, censor and control the information written.

  60. P

    I’m with John, gmail has a certain “Emperor’s New Clothes” to it as far as I’m concerned. It’s *OK*, but it’s not the mail client of all mail clients.

  61. Srini Kumar

    Knol is such an incredibly dumb name that it almost seems like a misdirection. Could Google really have become so square?

    #59 accidentally renamed this product correctly. It should be called Google Know.

    -s

  62. Pat McClung

    The only way one can get at truth without the filters of personality and greed is to post (publish) information without the hope of profit or recognition and without a care in hell if anybody reads it or not.

    Tha is the only way to get at truth, and that’s the Wikipedia way.

  63. w2i

    Yet another in-depth analysis of and different view on the Google/Wikipedia case can be found over here:
    http://web2innovations.com/mon.....wikipedia/

  64. Brad Flora

    Ok. Here’s a hypothetical I’ve been running in my head since reading this post.

    1. I have extensive experience with a specific field of knowledge. Let’s say I used to design soup can labels for Campbell’s.

    2. Looking to make some cash off this knowledge and to establish myself as a bit of an authority on soup label design, I sign up for Knols immediately upon launch. I write 10 high-quality knols, one on general soup label design and 9 others on specific companies and how they designed their soup labels. I list myself as someone with years of experience in the soup label design field. Let’s assume my work is interesting, compelling and original.

    3. Having created these articles, I sit back with a smile on my face, expecting them to be rated highly (after all, we’re assuming they’re great and original) and for the clicks to start coming in. Also, let’s say I planted some links in the articles to my blog where I write about soup can labels. I expect these links to send some traffic and some pagerank juice over to it. Because my articles were so good, I don’t feel bad about planting these links at all.

    4. But instead, to my horror, I start to see other Knols popping up about soup can label design…..USING MY CONTENT or SLIGHTLY altered versions of what I wrote. They’ve also redirected the links to point to their own sites. The author bios are from people claiming my exact same credentials…but when I call my friends still working in the industry, I learn that these people do not exist. I send Google an e-mail….no response. Also, to my disappointment, the plagiarized knols are also being rated more often than my knol and being rated higher than mine!

    5. I do some poking around online and find out that the people writing the plagiarized knols also run several affiliate marketing web sites and spend their time hanging out in the digital point forum, exchanging knol ratings for diggs/reddit votes/stumbles. Every few minutes they send someone else over to give their knol a perfect rating and boost their prominence.

    6. Utterly disgusted, I take my knols down and decide to never contribute again.

    ——————

    This scenario seems quite likely to me. Thoughts?

  65. YDRIVE

    >Knol is such an incredibly dumb name that it almost seems like a misdirection.

    Not necessarily incredibly dumb… at least it rhymes with know, while could also mean KNowledge OnLine (if not just simply Knowledge, as you knol) in addition to its being suggested by Google as a noun meaning “a unit of knowledge”…

    But in any case, nothing has been as incredibly dumb as… Orkut… as a servicename for a wanting-to-be-big social network.. imagine what if google.com (or googol.com as the founders alledgedly originally wanted) was named sergey.com or larry.com instead (which still easier than, what, orkut??!) :-D

  66. Google-knol-blog

    Will Google delete Wikipedia.org from their search ? hmmmmm..

    Wikipedia will then die a quick death.

  67. Faisal

    With all due respect, i don’t think this story was written by you Mike!

  68. Permeate

    I’m with John, gmail has a certain “Emperor’s New Clothes” to it as far as I’m concerned. It’s *OK*, but it’s not the mail client of all mail clients.

    You might consider it groupthink, but people are flocking to Gmail because it has the best spam filter out there, hands down. There are a lot of features (as far as web-based mail goes) such as this, that other clients can’t even come close to. I just think it’s absurd to say that it’s a poorly designed product. I guess everyone is entitled to their own opinion…

  69. Me

    On wikia…it won’t be a Google killer for the same reason that Wikipedia is non-profit.

    People are not going to do charity work for a for-profit company.

  70. Ballmer

    Gaggle is evil!
    Why do companies like these people want to get into everything and just concentrate on the things they are supposedly good at?

    fakesteveballmer.blogspot.com

  71. John

    Permeate: I dont whether people are flocking or not, I assume you have some stats. I agree that it has good features - I use Googlemail and wouldnt if it didnt

    BUT the GUI is in my opinion really poor. It is not intuitive - The screens are terribly cluttered - you cannot see at a glance which button to click to perform an action or navigate elsewhere, and this is counter to so much WEB 2.0 start-up design, which is if nothing else focuses on the needs of the “idiot user” - applications should be easy to follow and navigate around.

    Gmail looks as if it has been cobbled together and the cobbling appears to continue.

    For example if I am in the middle of composing an e-mail and I decide I want to search my address book to copy someone else, I have to either abandon my e-mail or put it into draft … as far as I can see. If I am reading an e-mail and want to reply the reply button is tucked away far down the screen - it is not highlighted or obvious.

    Whereas I really like the Picasa GUI and Notebook has recently got better although at the start it was IMHO poor GUI, but a useful (for me)application.

    This seems to sum up a laissez-faire attitude to design by Google that “permeates” many of their products. Get it out fast -design it later with user input - in long term Betas.

    I suspect Knol will be much the same.

  72. Me

    @Brad Flora (#64), very thought provoking analysis.

    My take is that Knol owners have the copyright on their page, so it’s not commons based information.

    So, if somebody has copy pasted the page, there has to be a take-down request feature for the copied information.

    If it’s just paraphrased and rewritten information with no copyright violation, that already happens throughout the web.

    As for encouraging others to vote through “voting exchanges”, I see that as one potential pitfall for this project, and one that Google should really pay close attention to.

    Any site that allows these voting rings to form should be taken off Google, for example, for good, and the violating authors banned.

  73. Murali

    So much for “do no evil”. Google, Infoseek tried it, but failed, you were just lucky, don’t push it.

  74. Brad Flora

    @Me (#72)

    Having your content re-written all over the web DOES happen all the time…but how responsive is Google going to be to cease and desists? That’s a big question mark for me.

    I think I read this in one of the comments on an earlier TC Knol story, but I expect to see a ton of Knol’s in high-paying niches and relatively few in interesting but hard-to-monetize areas. For people who are really interested in that, why wouldn’t they head over to Wikipedia for their info?

    I dunno, I’m just skeptical of how much incentive there’s really going to be for someone like my hypothetical soup can label guy (who seems like the idea contributor) to get involved.

  75. Greenengineseo

    knowledge is power only if you have a paid sponsor next to it.

  76. Scott Gamon

    Knols are more like CafeMom than Wikipedia: They do not have to be in neutral point of view. They are more likely to be first-person, informed opinions, much like blog posts. The author owns the words, and does not have to fight over the contents. It will be obvious who the author is, allowing us to apply reputation as a filter. It will attract a whole new group of authors who are uncomfortable writing for wikipedia. This complments the knowledge in wikipedia, rather than competing with it.

  77. Karma Debugger

    “Wikipedia gets massive support from the community”. Maybe. But the charm is waning, as it is becoming clear, that a mere mortal is not capable of editing Wikipedia, if his approach is not approved by the staff. WP will soon turn into another DMOZ, if they don’t change something, somehow. The first Google result for the “tragedy of the commons” search is a Wikipedia page.

  78. Anthony Bailey

    “Anyone writing for Knol is likely to at least peruse Wikipedia content before publishing. And if they see anything good, they are at liberty to simply lift and copy it over to Knol, and get a adsense check for their time.”

    Not that simply. They can do this only if they republish under the same terms that the Wikipedia content is licensed under, which is the GNU Free Documentation license:

    http://wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Copyrights
    http://www.gnu.org/licenses/fdl.html

    In Creative Commons terminology, its a BY-SA license - i.e. attribution (credit the original authors whose Wikipedia article you used, which doesn’t fit very well with the trusted single author by-line approach of Knol) and share-alike (so you have to license derivative works under the same terms.) Will Knol even accept content licensed this way?

    The two licenses (Gnu FDL and CC BY-SA) are sufficiently similar that an initiative to enable compatibility between the two licenses is reaching its final stages.

  79. DC

    Yoga was hot a few years ago. People didn’t immediately know what yoga was, so they researched it.

    Let’s say knol existed then.

    I’d prefer not to have sifted through 150 knols on the topic of yoga, all published by anyone and everyone who could plagiarize or copy/paste free content in hopes of getting some AdSense dollars.

    “But the best one’s will sift to the top!”

    How? By me going through the first 75?

    Let me explain some simple rules of advertising:

    - Good content attracts a crowd
    - Ads works when the content is good because the crowd is big.
    - The only to ensure good content is to control who can create it.

    This model works:
    TV - good shows, more ad revenue. Bad shows, no revenue
    Google - good search results, more ad revenue. Bad, none
    Wikipedia - good search results = potentially big revenue
    YouTube - random content, hard to monetize
    Knol - too much unfiltered content, hard to monetize

  80. Les Penee

    Have you checked for how much money contributors make at sites like suite101.com and helium.com? There will be minimal incentive for anyone to abandon Wikipedia, which continues to maintain a level of quality.

    I predict that good contributors will remain with Wikipedia, and Google Knol will become saturated with mediocre content. Quality-driven contributors would then avoid Knol in order to protect their integrity.

    Knol could compete with suite101.com and helium.com, though.

  81. Peter Toris

    There are 2 124 000 articles on Wikipedia. If Google asks 10 000 experts (or lets say the 60 000 people in “How is Who” and they are listed there for a good reason) in every field to write 212.4 articles each then you get the content.
    Lets say this will take a year before Google lets me and you edit/contribute or deface each article. But Knol articles will be locked so it’s not going to be possible to actually edit the original articles without the authors’ permission but only to add comments and suggestions.
    The authors will be assured that the content is safe and the first 10 000 authours will get the first run on the ad revenue. Simple.