Wikipedia Sued For Nazi Sympathies

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1. 113.com
   

   December 6th, 2007 at 9:49 pm

   Relate that to why China blocks wikipedia…

2. Antje Wilsch
   

   December 6th, 2007 at 10:08 pm

   I just read about this and had taken a look earlier and I would say I have to rather agree. German is a very nuanced language, as is English, where depending on the exact word used in a particular way and the context all together can lend itself to different meanings- all shades of grey. The problem with this is the writer can feign innocence “but I never *meant* it that way” knowing full well things can be intrepreted in varying shades of meaning.

   That being said, the language about the history is almost obsessive. It strikes me as being written by nazi lover(s) bursting at the seams to obey the rules but literally walking the lines to see how far they can push. It almost sounds barely concealed pride vs. a tone of scholastic approach, let alone critical.

   The history of the national socialist party in Germany and the rise of Hitler and the subsequent loyal followers it maintains even to this day is way too involved for a TC comment but the guard is always up against scope creep. People ARE turing to Wikipedia for information and it’s seen as a tool of facts and knowledge by many and I think they have an obligation to keep this in mind, as the same for any country with a bloody history discussing that time period.

   but then again I disagree with a lot of the editing that the english language version of wikipedia too and would call a few of them fascists in the most non-literal manner….

3. Johnny
   

   December 6th, 2007 at 10:19 pm

   Shubert is an idiot.
   Why would you take wikipedia to court because you think they are soft towards the Nazi’s thats a loud of shit. If you disagree with what someone has written change it, isnt that the whole point behind wikipedia.

   I dont get people like this. Wikipedia is great product possibly the best thing to happen to the net in many years. Its free and most of the information in there is brilliant. Why would she do this I hate people like this.
   She needs to get a life

4. Why block it?
   

   December 6th, 2007 at 10:25 pm

   Why Germans want to block it?

   They fear losing GDP and trading power with the world. They want Wii, Playstation 3, Starbucks, Mattel, Chinese made toys, oil, iphone, Vista, etc…
   For example, If Nazi germany won World war 2… They can’t get Apple, IBM, starbucks, and even Facebook.

5. Rajeev
   

   December 6th, 2007 at 10:26 pm

   I think no individual or group should be allowed to manipulate or operate dysfunctional social engineering.

   http://tekno-world.blogspot.com

6. Ethocom
   

   December 6th, 2007 at 10:30 pm

   We have some “Reactionnary” attitude on Wikipedia France Too :/
   For Who understand French ^^ I have keep a copy

   http://artistik-intelligence-a....._money.htm

   ^^

   Note : some “neo-fa” have a “steal infodominance strategy”, i notice this attitude in middle europe, in several domain , music , party , art.

   It’s always : no no it’s you don’t understand … we denonce these thesis …
   But when digg you find some “libertycide” Thinktank …

   See you

7. lawrence
   

   December 6th, 2007 at 10:35 pm

   it’s a ridiculous claim, by overtly sensitive people - you can’t erase history, you know.

   the charge won’t win.

8. Henrich Himmler
   

   December 6th, 2007 at 10:41 pm

   Heil Hitler! I edit Wikipedia! The Nazis Will Rise again!

9. Jimbo W
   

   December 6th, 2007 at 10:44 pm

   These Jews Shall Not Stop My Plan! Heil Hitler!

10. roflcop
    

    December 6th, 2007 at 10:45 pm

    I actually went to Wikipedia.org to check and makesure the logo was fake

11. Dan Rogers
    

    December 6th, 2007 at 10:47 pm

    Right if the information posted is right then no body can maintain the claim. Wikipedia is a respected site committed to bring the right information to everyone. There being biased can not be a valid claim.
    Dan
    http://www.goforads.com

12. Marco
    

    December 6th, 2007 at 10:51 pm

    The German Left Party is in fact the several times renamed SED, the dictatorial party of the former Communist East Germany (GDR). So it’s not suprising anyway. The Left Party fights freedom of speech, freedom of information, freedom at all.

    To German Wikipedia: In general, the moderators or administrators are leaning towards leftist ideologies and that is markable. When ever possible I use the English language Wikipedia. Articles there are in general more neutral, more fair, less ideological.

13. Steve Ballmer
    

    December 6th, 2007 at 11:07 pm

    I thought there was something about these jack-booted thugs I didn’t like!

    http://fakesteveballmer.blogspot.com

14. Mo
    

    December 6th, 2007 at 11:09 pm

    Katina Schubert is doing that on her own. She’s getting no support from her party. Even better, the party distances itself from this campaign.

15. Marco
    

    December 6th, 2007 at 11:15 pm

    @Johnny

    “She needs to get a life”

    Communists don’t have a life. That’s why they try to change ours to hell.

16. Axel
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 12:13 am

    “This isn’t about restricting freedom of opinion, it’s about examining what the limits are.”

    Are “restrictions” and “limits” not synonyms in German?

17. Phoenix
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 12:20 am

    Pah! Why can’t Germans face their own guilt and live through it? Do they wish to put a blanket over History and think that the world is not going to know?

18. Marco
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 12:26 am

    @Axel

    You’re right. The quoted sentence is nonsens.

    “beschränken” means restricting. “beschränken” comes from “schranke” which means barrier or … limit!

    But even in English it’s nonsense. If you are setting a limit, you restrict and vice versa.

19. Marco
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 12:35 am

    @Phoenix

    Seems that you have no idea what’s going on here in Germany these days. The communist Left Party does not sue Wikipedia to “put a blanket over History”. They want the state to control your whole live and what you know about history, politics and so on. They don’t like a free debate about all that.

    For example, they tell you in state school (and there are only state schoos or schools monitored and contolled by state authoritys in Germany) that all Germans are guilty till doomsday and that it is not allowed to show patriotism as seen at the Soccer World Cup because of the Nazi past.

    After this event, the teachers union commanded their members (nearly 90% of all teachers) to educate the children not to wave the national flag or to sing the anthem …

    That’s what this is about. They want to control us and what we think and feel …

20. Yella
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 1:02 am

    “Die Linke” is a case for itself in Germany, a very sad political party. I personally believe that many “left” minded and “right” minded people are quite alike. Regarding “Die Linke” it’s sad that after the younger (DDR) history in Germany a party with views like that is actually active.

21. FreeSpeech
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 2:32 am

    You think there’s free speech and democracy on Wikipedia?
    Think again and check this out:
    “That’s how Wikipedia founder Jimmy “Jimbo” Wales described his famously-collaborative online encyclopedia in a recent puff piece from The New York Times Magazine. “The core community appreciates when someone is knowledgeable,” he said, “and thinks some people are idiots and shouldn’t be writing.”

    This is true. Despite its popular reputation as a Web 2.0 wonderland, Wikipedia is not a democracy. But the totalitarian attitudes of the site’s ruling clique go much further than Jimbo cares to acknowledge.”

    Wikipedia black helicopters circle Utah’s Traverse Mountain
    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2.....overstock/

    and
    Secret mailing list rocks Wikipedia
    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2.....t_mailing/

22. Henning Krieg
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 2:37 am

    One important fact should be clarified here:
    Katina Schubert has not sued Wikipedia for nazi sympathies, as mentioned in the headline, nor has she “taken Wikipedia to the court”, as Johnny writes. What Schubert has done is to report a (suspected) offence to the police. This report obliges police/prosecutors to take a look into the matter and to proceed with their investigations in case they suspect Wikipedia / the people behind it to indeed have committed an offence.

    Schubert is heavily criticised in German media for her step. For example, she has not raised the issue with Wikipedia first, but immediately contacted police. Furthermore, also after having done so she did not contact Wikipedia. Schubert claims her co-workers could not find a contact adress. However, a simple look into the imprint would have helped. A link to the imprint is in the footer of every site on Wikipedia. Including the one Schubert reported to the police.

23. Parul Bindra
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 2:45 am

    Must say a fascinating piece of news on the front page!. I think the Communists are quite confused the manner Internet functions. All the expressions are welcomed. Good or Bad.

    Parul
    http://www.bhopu.com

24. I Am Not Posting To Spam My Blog
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 2:53 am

    This is so far out of field that it’s not worth getting in a fuss about. The German Communists have no credibility whatsoever. Yella is right; the Communists are the best example of the fact that the left-right political spectrum is not a line, but a circle - the extremes meet in the middle, and whether you call that point communism or fascism they’re virtually indistinguishable.

    It really is about time Germany got over itself. The ban on swastikas, for example, is counterproductive and needs to be lifted - fringe political groups like nothing more than to feel persecuted. Games like Return to Castle Wolfenstein, which get banned in Germany unless they remove the swastikas from every banner and every bad guy’s uniform, are not Nazi training simulators. (How could they be when you spend most of the time killing Nazis, and even ripping down the Nazi banners to check for secret areas behind them?) The Nazis are gone, spent, kaputt even. The Germans are treating them like a kid who thinks there’s monsters under the bed who will tear him apart if he looks at them. What they need to do is shine a torch directly at them, at which point they will evaporate into thin air.

25. Adolf Hitler
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 3:23 am

    Stop dissing and badmouthing National Socialism. We were alleged to have killed 12 million, but the Soviet Union, Red China, Pol Pot’s Cambodia, Vietnam, North Korea, etc., combined, conservatively killed 60 million-80million+ people.-Adolf Hitler

26. Christop Wagner
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 3:34 am

    Funny, in german blogs the discussion is quite normal (with nearly everyone saying Schubert is kinda stupid and doesn’t understand anything about the net). Here on TechCrunch there are a lot of Nazi comments on the one side and a lot of plain stupid comments on the other side with only some in between seeming like the posters posses a working brain.

    Anyway, she already withdrew her charge and now wants a discussion. Funny, she said she would’ve wanted one before but she couldn’t find a contact address. Cause it’s so damn hard to find the “Impressum” link on every page…

27. A Reasonable Man
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 6:26 am

    “# 113.com

    December 6th, 2007 at 9:49 pm

    Relate that to why China blocks wikipedia…”

    Ok: Because the facist Chinese government doesn’t want the competition? The great thing about jack booted thugs is they all look the same whether they’re rounding up roma or women pregnant with their second child, or maybe just some guy unfortunate enough to annoy a provincial governor.

    Beijing 2008 - Berlin 1936, the only difference is the food…

28. David B. Founder of MoFuse.com
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 8:43 am

    Americans have a hard time understanding restrictions or limits on freedoms of speech. I personally don’t think there should be any. The German government shouldn’t try to censor it’s past in any way, even if they deem it to go beyond what they see as educational.

    What’s stopping them from denouncing anti-administration speech as ‘nazi’ and limiting it?

    If they’re truly scared of a new Nazi uprising maybe they should combat that with better ideas, a more sound economy, etc. This is how you put it to rest, not by acting like it never happened.

29. André Wegner
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 8:48 am

    Ms. Schubert paddled back. She is not filing charges against Wikipedia anymore, but saying she would like to discuss with them.

30. Evie
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 8:58 am

    Pictures of hot German men in tight uniforms on wikipedia turned me into a Nazi! YES!! Heil Hitler!!!

31. Sneezy Melon
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 10:42 am

    well, one coin always has two sides and you HAVE TO keep one up!

32. Kai
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 12:48 pm

    I’m German and I hate Nazis. But this is just stupid. German politicians have just too much time on their hands… The political and juridical system in German is so fricken conservative that it just doesn’t know how to handle the Web 2.0 era where everyone can speak up… Poor Germany…

33. Whatever
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 1:17 pm

    Oh the irony.

    We don’t like people to be Nazis….so let’s act just like them in repressing free speech and ideas.

    But instead of calling ourselves Nazis, we’ll just call ourselves “Progressives”.

34. Dean Steadman
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 1:29 pm

    @ Whatever

    You’re absolutely correct. Free speech ain’t pretty and protecting/spreading it includes allowing the fraking Nazi’s to speak.

35. Bob Jones
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 1:45 pm

    I’m sure Hitler is turning in his grave wondering why he didn’t make a platform that could be edited by anyone, Nazis, non-Nazis, the allies, etc, to spread his beliefs … I’m sure that would have been a much better plan for propoganda …

    Oh wait, his system of propoganda was closed, like all systems of propoganda, where people can’t edit it.

    To 27, I must say I think the German economy is sound … too sound, the reunification of Germany has made them the biggest economy in Europe, leaving Britain aside … and we helped reunify them …

36. Hanna Reitsch
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 3:20 pm

    The only reason an article like this exists and why the German Govt. suppresses their people is that there might just be something good about National Socialism, and even Nazi ideology.

    If they were smart, they wouldn’t baby-sit the population.

37. Rollo
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 3:57 pm

    #24 I Am Not Posting: Great comment, your analogy in the last couple of lines is spot on.

38. Fred Sanford
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 9:20 pm

    Lets leave information alone and let it be what it is good or bad. More evil has been done trying to limit the spread of ideas than the ideas them selves.

    Now shut it big dummy!

39. McNasty15001
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 9:52 pm

    Let’s see, Soviet Socialist objects to National Socialist commentary. At least they’re not shooting it out in the Ukraine this time.

40. Dale
    

    December 7th, 2007 at 11:26 pm

    Everybody should be entitled to there own opinion, even if it is sadistic or racist

41. K.ravindran
    

    December 10th, 2007 at 1:03 am

    I understand that the suit against Wikepedia has just been dropped.

42. Justin
    

    December 10th, 2007 at 12:15 pm

    This is absurd. As the woman said, though, she’s reacting to the larger neo-Nazi movement, esp. in her country, and she’s trying to flesh out where the legal lines are. And I sympathize with anti-Nazi people, but…

    Wikipedia is not at all legally culpable for people writing encyclopedic content in a tone that isn’t appreciated by some people. And, if it is anywhere on the planet, it should not be.

    You’ve got to keep speech and expression out of the courts. Although, obviously, I hate Nazism, I believe that people in the Western world, the modern world, that is, should enjoy freedom of speech (expression). I understand that we’re talking about Germany, and this is a sore subject. As it should be. The Germans should continue to make a show of there disdain for the crimes of their fathers and grandfathers. However, they’ve instead relied on a strategy of just ignoring it, and refusing to even talk about it. This was confirmed by a professor of mine, a German, who travels to Germany and appears in conferences, or television talk groups, etc. They won’t even properly discuss the subject — and undoubtedly, some of their reasons for not discussing the subject clearly (and condemningly) are related to the policy cited by the woman initiating this suit — that showing too much Nazi symbolism, etc., basically too much of anything that is considered Nazi related, is taboo. As the culture has a way of reinforcing and extending culture-related law, they don’t even talk about Nazism, in addition to not showing symbols. (What on earth do they fear? That just showing a swastika, along with a clear depiction of the horrors of Nazism will somehow induce people to join a neo-Nazi group? Quite the opposite. The only reason anyone was induced to become a Nazi was because the horrors were never presented — and those that were presented were only presented after a slow process of mass indoctrination, and a long slide down a slippery slope.)

    As someone stated above, get involved with Wikipedia if you don’t like the way an article is being presented — you’ll not only be right-ing a wrong, you’ll be doing the world a favor. Otherwise, leave speech and expression free, especially on the internet. A man should be able to say anything, anything at all, and it’s the job of good men to counter anything said by bad men with their own speech and writing.

    That’s why I contribute to Wikipedia — to spread truth, and counter any falsehoods that might try to take advantage of Wikipedia.

    Legislation can never achieve what widespread participation in Wikipedia can — because the mass of men are good (enough), and sincere in their participation in a project that aims to communicate truth to the masses. Legislation (and legal interpretations) that restrict freedom of expression on Wikipedia or elsewhere only deter people from participating — which, in the end, will slow or stop the process of truth winning out over falsehood and ideology disguised as encyclopedic content.

    So, thanks be to God that the suit was dropped.

43. Jewjg
    

    December 11th, 2007 at 1:44 am

    Soon the Germans will not be able to speak their own language or discuss their history in an honest or positive light, and thus we Jews will be avenged for our Shoah(TM).