When Google was asked during the press conference earlier today if they had invited Facebook into OpenSocial, the answer was “yes,” and then changed to “we can’t comment, followed by “we have reached out to virtually everyone in this space” (quotes are rough, I was taking notes but not recording). Whichever one is the correct answer, the clear indication was that Google was reaching out to Facebook to join the club.
Facebook, however, says they haven’t had the pleasure. When we asked them if they were planning on joining, Brandee Barker, Director of corporate communications at Facebook, responded:
Despite reports, Facebook has still not been briefed on OpenSocial. When we have had a chance to understand the technology, then Facebook will evaluate participation relative to the benefits to its 50 million users and 100,000 platform developers.
My bet is that they join. Because suddenly Facebook is being painted as the closed outsider while everyone else is allowing the use of non proprietary coding platforms (Facebook requires the use of FBML, not HTML) and portability of applications.
How did they turn into the bad guys so quickly? As Erick says, it’s their move. But no matter what they do, Google has pulled off an absolute coup.
For their part, Google will certainly want Facebook’s participation. But they had to get everyone else on board first, before Facebook would even consider it. An open platform means no social network has any advantage over any other when it comes to third party applications. The playing field has been evened, and no one wins. Except Google. They always win.
Update: From a trusted source:
People in the know have indicated to me that Facebook and Google have been talking about OpenSocial…including today. So pleading ignorance won’t last as a strategy for dealing with the OpenSocial movement.
Dan Farber is also reporting this.
I can see tremendous benefit for fb joining this war .. I would love to see a social ads platform from fb and now that would be a checkmate for goog. .
opps .. a typo .. I wanted to say joining open social .
Facebook allows developers to use HTML. FBML is optional and is mostly there for the sake of convenience.
This was previously pointed out in the comments for another writeup which made the same error.
Yeap… My dreams come true.
Too much press like this. It’s going to make Facebook & Google angry.
The only long-term winners are those who provide infrastructure. If you think Google will have market cap anywhere near it does now, you are sadly dreaming. We’re just a few Federal announcements from Webvan, part 2.
Everything’s coming up Milhouse.
Oh, wait, no. I forgot; Google is gold. Apple too. It’s all one big lovefest.
GOOGLE RULES FOREVER! THEY ARE SO SMART AND CAN DO NO WRONG!
Why is it that Google Always Wins ?
I would work for free for these guys just to understand their talents as strategists
The equation is:
(Facebook + Microsoft) - Google = Slow demise? Definitely a negative number at the least.
“The playing field has been evened, and no one wins. Except Google. They always win.”
Great quote Michael!
Did you know Google got lot of enemies?
Viacom, Microsoft, Facebook, Powerset, etc…
we know that brandee probably has the best intentions but I think she has to realize that facebook users - their 50m users- are going to probably use both/all. I take offense to her assumption that she will decide if WE (the users) will particiapte. Facebook is rather smug and even when their PR person acts like it- maybe they should realize that they’ve just been slapped.
I’d love it if one of you top bloggers dared all the social networking sites to allow users to delete their accounts.
I think we are all about to realize the true value of facebook.
Knowing Google, they’ll start bullying people once everyone gets on board opensocial like they do with adsense and their search engine.
I also don’t like how they give established players an early lead. Leaves the rest of us peons even further behind.
oh they’ll “join” just to keep competitive tabs… the internet is littered with failed initiatives. with so many cooks in this pot… this one is bound to fail. and who is going to trust google to mind the kitty. no one. it’s all spin… but they got techcrunch to blog about a freakin million times. somebody’s earning their retainer.
Deja Vu…
Four years ago. I predict this shit. Mike going to get punch in face. Press will see his nosebleed. It was all camera flash.
I have no idea who punch mike face. I can’t see the future yet.
Why do you have write this press?
Undo it or delete it.
Way to go Google. Here’s to Facebook joining in the near future.
@ #3
If FBML is optional, how come no one has mentioned it? Not TC or Andreesen.
Google pulled the ultimate competitive chess move - i agree with you and seeing the video of Eric and Chris from Scoble shows they are confident. Facebook is a bunch of rookies…
Mike: hears a headline for you; Facebook: Deer in the headlights.
I just want to see how long Facebook will take to end the first world war of social networks: Facebook vs. All Others.
With the FB platform, it is not possible to place generic HTML/Javascript in the profile window (only a subset of FBML is allowed). This is why, for example, it is currently impossible to implement a hit counter for a FB profile. With OpenSocial, this (and many other things) will be possible.
Facebook got Google engineers and guys profile account. hehehhe
Google just pulled one hell of a coup and all I can do is laugh. Smart move Google, very smart indeed! lol
I think Facebook may have enough power to not join though and I don’t think it’ll be as detrimental as some think, if they decide not to join. I’m still using Facebook regardless.
From facebook.com: “Facebook Markup Language (FBML) is an evolved subset of HTML with some elements removed, and others which have been added that are specific to Facebook.”
So they took out some unsafe tags and added some Facebook-specific tags. No problem there.
All of the answers are true! What is you guys problem?
http://fakesteveballmer.blogspot.com
So it’s Thursday, Mikes been on the conference call - where is this OpenSocial thing? Can I use it yet? Can I integrate it into my own social network software (or is it not really “open”?).
Facebook is claiming to have 50M (60% of which are non-u.s.based). what is the real number? Or is it what most are stating between 30 M or 40M? i’d like to know an accurate number. 30M=12Million U.S. users, if the new FB number is claiming 50M then that means 20M U.S. users.
What is MySpace’s claim versus actual also?
Great coverage!
side note:
Michael Arrington said:……”quotes are rough, I was taking notes but not recording)”
This was awesome. Spoken like a true lawyer:)
Numbers Shmumbers…. They are worth 15 bill………
And as if Google is going to invite them in on Open Source
Listening to the press conference recording, it was a shambles with little attempt at organization. Mike’s right, it was a very confusing answer. Now that the love fest is over there are huge hurdles to overcome and almost nothing on time frames for deliverables.
@17 & 20
I can’t speculate as to why various people don’t display a deep understanding of Facebook development. The fact remains that developers have 2 main options regarding how they develop a Facebook app:
1. Develop an FBML-based app, which restricts content to Facebook-allowed code (FBML which is parsed by Facebook’s servers).
or
2. An iframe based app, over which Facebook has no control. In this case, anything goes.
It is true that for the profile box a developer must use FBML, but the profile box is a tiny part of most apps, and is usually non-interactive.
However, regardless of whether or not HTML is allowed, the fact remains that the Facebook world remains somewhat “closed.” In my mind this is because Facebook is putting a huge amount of effort into keeping the user experience clean and consistent. So far I think they have been doing a good job of striking a balance between freedom and consistency, but only time will tell if the strategy is successful.
I still cant get over how quickly this has happened. Open doors have been talked about for a long time, but now in the space of days everyones joining up. Erick did have a point though: FB still holds the consumers imagination but certainly if we start seeing improved platform offerings this could flip nearly as quickly as FB grew.
Speculating on Facebook’s next move Nov 6th in NY… could Facebook do any better than to launch SocialAds (social advertising network to Google’s search advertising network) AND announce that SocialAds (but not Facebook.com) would support OpenSocial. Wouldn’t that put them in position to reap the benefits of OpenSocial without giving up the benefits of their closed Platform?
only to developers on techcrunch is this a “OMG OMG PWNED” move…to a regular joe who uses facebook they don’t really care that other sites are getting this stuff.
I couldn’t agree more. Google wins. The other social networks win less. The end users win. Who loses? The developers. It’ll almost be like winning the lottery on a much grander scale (Facebook vs. OpenSocial). All this free development from starved developers for these social networks.
Google laid the hammer down by announcing OpenSocial. For those out there that thought that Facebook was the next big thing and would lead to Google’s eventual downfall, think again. Google has done it again by strategically abstracting themselves from the social network wars:
http://fishtrain.com/2007/11/0.....ification/
Patrick@32: There are NO benefits to a closed network that outweigh the costs. Just ask AOL.
Facebook does not derive its value from being a platform. It derives its value from being a Network, and a Network’s value grow geometrically with the size of the network.
OpenSocial now has a network twice the size of Facebook, which means it’s an order of magnitude more valuable. From here on out (as long as Facebook is closed) every social network user has to weigh the benefit of investing X units of time on Facebook for Y value, or the same time on OpenSocial for Y^2 value. It’s a no brainer to go with Open Social.
Google wins this round. Lets see how Facebook responds.
I wonder what sort of widgets we will see and how they compare to the current ones on Facebook. So far I am not impressed with the ones on FB.
So what does this mean for the average user? I go to MySpace and still see a clusterfuck of ads and useless info in the profiles.
You can have the biggest social network in the world but if it’s not clean, and easy to navigate, like Facebook, I won’t use it.
Hopefully the OpenSocial platform will give the users an opportunity to gain some financial benefit for all the work we do. I think FB should join in for the best interest of its users. Besides, who are they for, the users or themselves? Makes me think they want to close everyone out so they can harp all the profits. Hmmmm……..
http://www.myciti.us
#28
The $15 mill valuation seems a bit premature now doesn’t it? This is a lot to chew for FB. Their first real-life obstacle. How they respond to it will either make people squirm in their seats or realize FB’s long-term potential and value.
Id like to know exactly how Open Social can be considered open, particularly if it is owned by one company?
I mean, its not open like DNS or HTTP or TCP is it?
This is EXACTLY the same strategy as MS giving away DOS for ‘free’.
Once applications have plugged into your operating system, whether it is based on a kernel or a web-stack, you have them by the balls.
Wake up GOOG fanboys. Now one company is the social-switch between all web-apps and sees all.
Amit, how is this a real life obstacle? At this point OpenSocial hasn’t proven itself yet, there is nothing real life about it.
Most of the people advocating OpenSocial have no idea why FB is so great, profiles aren’t covered in random apps & spam (yet).
Facebook must not and never should move as a direct result of Google’s activities. Such cowardice would send a shoddy signal to the market, despite the trumpeting of Openness or whatever. There is plenty of room in the development cycle at this point for two platforms, and now it seems that there will be no more to challenge these two titans.
Facebook has absolutely nothing to fear, even from a coalition such as OpenSocial. Widget developers are the big winners as now there is no need to learn a hundred separate API’s to get published everywhere (other than Facebook that is). But Facebook has not to date been the kind of company that gets bullied by Google or anyone else, and they should do everything in their power to shrug their shoulders and say “whatever” to this announcement, at least for the short term.
I actually think the ILLUSION of openness - hey come develop on our proprietary platform - is a competitive advantage Facebook has created. Those thirty-to-fifty-million kids aren’t going anywhere soon, not to mention the growth (esp. international). Facebook gets its own family of 100,000 developers, all adding value in a very Facebook-specific way to the Facebook platform. Now they don’t actually HAVE to open up - they are “open enough”. If they manage to put a “screw you google” PR spin on it, they may even manage to spur some of that old fierce user loyalty they used to have back when they were “cool”.
Facebook knows its users, and its userbase is large enough to pull any widgetmaker to comply with Facebook along with OpenSocial. This gives Facebook power, more than say Steve Jobs has over software developers, and could it perhaps be that Facebook has far larger plans for its platform than merely “making it open”? Facebook should simply smile to itself and consider how well its strategy is working. Basically, OpenSocial is a boon to widget developers, and it would appear that a major reason for its existence is the power of the Facebook platform model. We owe Facebook one, and we aren’t going to leave those users who are making us feel so cool behind. And they aren’t on Bebo or anywhere else - those users who we love are on Facebook.
100,000 widget developers is one hell of a head start, and maintaining their prime spot in the attention of these developers - regardless of whether they code to OpenSocial as well - is their winning strategy. They can only maintain this positioning through being distinct. The only way they lose is if GOOGLE THEMSELVES comes up with the must-have widget of the millenium, and they refuse to make it compatible with the Facebook platform. My guess is that they’d have to do something crazy cool to achieve this, some kind of new phenomenon in widgetry, and then someone else would clone it for the Facebook platform anyway.
Having a large market share is one thing, having a SOPHISTICATED market share is quite another. Facebook’s userbase is very innovative, open, and demanding of true niftyness. This is another competitive advantage - it isn’t just numbers, it’s quality, and Chris DeWolfe knows it.
-s
OpenSocial gives Facebook even more reason NOT to be open. It’s better for Facebook to be the “other choice” for developers, rather than one of dozens of choices.
Whoops sorry - forgot that the social networks, their users, and future platforms for social networking are winners too. Go Google! Google did a very cool thing, it would just be bad strategy for Facebook to open up its widget platform. To wit: since it is easy to convert a Facebook widget into an OpenSocial widget, but not necessarily vice versa, we are going to create our Facebook widget FIRST, and then port it to OpenSocial. This will be the way future widget developers will think, and Facebook should not give this primacy up.
Amit, how is this a real life obstacle? At this point OpenSocial hasn’t proven itself yet, there is nothing real life about it.
Most of the people advocating OpenSocial have no idea why FB is so great, profiles aren’t covered in random apps & spam (yet).
what a move by google — they somehow always seem to play their cards right. i don’t think FB saw this coming as it happened so fast. FB’s arrogance may cost them a little as they may still be basking in the 200 million investment from MSFT.
FB probably is going to be “forced” to join or risk being outcast regardless of how big a market share they have in developers. I don’t buy the ignorance too as i believe they are much smarter than that.
like i said in one of the other blog posts today, it’s scary but we are so scared of being left behind that we are almost forced to follow google’s activities. no matter what anyone says — it is google’s world right now.
Pleading ignorance? There’s still a lot of ignorance about OpenSocial all around.
I fail to see how Google comes out on top of this if FB stays out of the OpenSocial network.
There’s going to be a movie titled “Dumbest Guys in the Room” if Facebook joins this initiative and becomes just another social network.
After all, the 100,00 developers that have pledged their efforts at FB are their competitive advantage. Why give that away????
this post was moving. like watching hoosiers, or rudy, or breaking away?