Glad US citizens didn’t make so much fuzz about Janet Jacksons breast accident.

I agree, if you don’t want to watch it than don’t if you do than do.

Wim

More bad work practices

Uh.. Ediz? Freedom of Speech= anything
Freedom of Speach does not equal anything - insults

Turkey needs to lighten up and take a joke once in awhile, stop being so reactionary.

By the way, as an American living in Istanbul, take a stab all you want at George Washington or any other American - I don’t care, I can handle it, I’m mature. You know what that is called? - Your opinion.

Opinions are ok. With freedom of expression, we are supposed to be able to argue and debate rationally, and if I don’t like it - who cares?

YouTube should not have caved. While I think the words in this video were abhorent and am glad the the Greek military is conducting an investigation into it’s source. Pulling it simply because the government of an country which has commited many of it’s own abhorent acts threatens to censor your website is pathetic. Freedom of speech is far more important that people taking offense to what has been said.

Information is always power, always. If Turks don’t want to hear that some unit of the Greek military hates them then they do themselves a disservice. Just because I don’t hear a gun shot doesn’t mean some body didin’t get shot.

YouTube aka Google is the largest information broker on the planet and they are showing a disturbing willingness to bow down to some of the most brutal governments in the world simply to make a buck. Their explianation for this is page right out of Neo Conservative handbooks. “Open markets will produce open societies.” It’s nothing more than a sad attempt at justifying making a deal with the devil. Perhaps YouTube should say to Turkey, we will not let you access our site unless you repeal the law which calls for the jailing of any person who speaks ill of Turkey.

It just goes to show, youtube and google have absolutely no scruples and will always sell out just to make a few more bucks. No amount of money is ever enough for these folks.

You can’t knuckle under to bullies. Ever.

I have to agree with Phil (comment 29): this was purely a business move. After Google caved to China’s demands about Falun Gong websites (among other things), they did so because they thought it was in their best economic self interest. I believe they will continue to make business driven decisions, regardless of what they or others believe is right. For better or worse, this is their stance.

istanbulexpat.. Turkish people have some concept called “Honor”, maybe you don’t understand it… or never heard of it. and maybe this explains why it’s ok for you for people to curse at George Washington, but Turkish people simply can’t take a curse against Ataturk, who is the founding father of Turkey. For the Greeks it’s the same. And they probably won’t say anything about George Washington, assuming that you have respect for him.

I personally find it shameful that you don’t care about George Washington… and that you’d be ok with people cursing at him.

I also have a hard time understanding how a person who has such a skewed perspective on these abstract things can have an opinion on freedom of expression?

Here is the video which almost got youtube banned in India. End of free speech = end of internet ?

http://iofvj.blogspot.com/2007.....ue-to.html

Stambouliote - I respect your right to express yourself openly - as you just did. Congratulations. You just voiced your opinion and supported my point.

Now, just imagine that I had to power to put you in jail for what you just said. Do you feel any better? Honor? My opinion (and freedom) allows me to laugh in anyone’s face - that is honor! I’m honored that George Washington and others stood up for these rights - yes it is true. But this honor didn’t come from years of conditioning that GW was the “founding father”.

“a person who has such a skewed perspective on these abstract things can have an opinion on freedom of expression” Kind of an ironic statement coming from someone who hates freedom of expression yet still expresses himself. In my opinion, if you don’t like it, just look the other way

The fact that you are trying to insult me just proves the hypocracy and makes me laugh. That’s my right. By the way - this is called an arguement, a debate - we are two reasonably prudent individuals just trying to have our say. Freedom of expression allows us to be civilized, if we do not have it, we fight to survive.

Well…

I would like to point this comment to Michael Arrington… I believe youtube has done the right thing by removing a video which offended a whole nation.

I understandable that you tout for freedom of speech, but what I see lacking is why dont you also support music, information and all that stuff being free, the way you support freedom of speech? Why do you not like allofmp3.com?

For many of the countries who hasnt yet placed MONEY as their main value in life , there are still other values that are at least as important as money if not more. Like honor, honesty, being a good citizen, fighting for your country(not for money) .

So I wanna ask you, why dont you treat the same those who are offering stuff that is sold for money for FREE?

Its all about the money isnt it? Nope my friend it isnt, and you will have to respect other values just as much as MONEY. And Youtube has done just that. Good Job Youtube Bravo

Cihan that just makes no sense, can I pay to see the Turk-bashing video somehow? I’ve never seen the meanings of the word ‘free’ so mashed into oblivion.

It’s Google’s site, they can do what they want. But the defense that it offended a bunch of people makes ZERO difference to me. It’s a voluntarily viewed video to begin with, for crying out loud. These people are simply looking to be offended. And if a society can’t keep from setting itself on fire when someone has a laugh at them, they shouldn’t be in the 21st century, much less on the Internet. Just turn it off.

Freedom of speech is not a part of a culture. It is a right every person has, and it’s not given by government. Some governments do act to destroy that right, but that doesn’t change the fact that it is an inalienable human right. A culture cannot be correct in forcibly restricting speech– period. That they do does not mean people that respect freedom have to respect or acquiesce or bow to their mistakes.

And just on a personal level, if your emotions are decided by what other people do or say, and you go searching out material that is offensive to you, you’re just plain pathetic. You have no control over your own life and have zero business giving advice to others.

Huh?

“… a blow to freedom of speech in Turkey.”

Last time I checked, the US Constitution didn’t apply beyond our borders.

There is no “freedom of speech” in Turkey. Never has been.

I wonder how TechCrunch would handle commenters using the N word? My guess … you’d “censor” those posts … right?

Would that be a blow to free speech?

youTube aka Google have put money before anything else. Business decisions are unfortunately ultimately driven by the bottom line.

Jumping into the political debate…..I am an Indian and yes I was deeply insulted when the Gandhi video was posted on the Internet. For me personally it was even more hurtful because I follow Buddhist principles and Gandhi was an ambassador for these principles.

But would I ban the website which hosted the video or prosecute the people who created it? No I would not. Gandhi himself fought for human rights and free speech. If he were around today I think he would be disappointed that we have suppressed free speech.

Also many people on this forum have used the phrase “freedom of speech” without understanding what it means. Did you ever think “Freedom” from what? “Freedom of speech” by its definition allows people to voice opinions which will offend/insult others. If you were always voicing opinions which never offended anyone you would never need “freedom of speech” as no one would stop you (or care as you would be irrelevant). That is exactly why you need ‘freedom’ from prosecution or censorship.

And like many things in else in life “freedom of speech” has a flip side. It cuts both ways. It allows you to voice your opinion about others but also allows others to voice their opinion about you. And yes it may insult you as well. But without it you cannot have a civilized society. In a civilized society people don’t suppress or kill each other, rather they debate with each other. And if you can’t take ‘it’ you have no right giving ‘it’ (or calling yourself a free society).

Oh… and by the way… you are free to reply to my post and disagree with my opinion or even insult me. I promise I will not ban you from the Internet or censor you or put you in jail.

“This sets a terrible precedent for YouTube, who should have stood their ground. The original videos were sophomoric jabs at Turkey from Greeks, none of which should have led to a ban in the first place.”

Standing your ground doesnt equal profit. And everyone is out for money. The end.

What happened to the Universal Declaration of human Rigths ?, is there a freedom of speech in Turkey OR online ?.

youtube video should be available to anyone regardless of color, political idealogy,sex,religion,race , culture etc.

I think YouTube took a decision that is good for its business and sometimes thats what you have to do.

Like it or not, the only thing on earth that matters for Google is your click on an ad. End of story.

I remember a very naive comment from an American journalist who was enthusing about US action to bring democracy in the middle-east, explaning there was still a lotta work to do and citing the fact that “there are places in Afghanistan where women cannot leave home unaccompanied by a male relative”.
That is so strikingly ethnocentrical.
And do not throw relativism at my face. We’re not talking about genital mutilation or the death penalty (USA can you hear me? )
Sure the banning was certainly not the best move Turkish bureaucrats have ever done - but nor was the spreading of that video. Just for the sake of pacific relations between Greece and Turkey, it’s just better that it was removed.
A French guy myself, I was as shocked as many of you by the manifestations of nationalism I had to face in Turkey. But what can you do ? Reeducate a whole people through YouTube ? Same goes in Ireland, where nationalism has been a synonym of liberation from the colonial power. And what about the US and its abhorred policies in the name of… in the name of what, by the way?
Mike, this was a very naive way to present information and the best one to create a troll topic which is getting close to verify Godwin’s Law…

you meant caves or capitulates…”folds” connotes more of an organizational demise.

You cannot expect freedom of Speech in a Muslim country. Let alone freedom for posting anf hosting offending videos!

Google should add an asterisk to their ‘do no evil’ motto to a more qualified statement cooked up by their lawyers- one that states the importance of profits and enriching shareholders.

Just goes to show, that when push comes to shove, Google’s a complete pussy.

Do no evil my ass. They won’t obey lawful, ethical sanctions by democratic nations, but they’re completely fine with censorship by oppressive regimes.

I hope Google burns to the ground.

lol…either way, I’d rather use http://www.Cavenger.com instead of youtube

I agree with all the comments I read…Now lets change the subject.

How about this: if you don’t like what those 3rd world countries do…like gasp…curtailing speech (but I somehow remember an Asian-American schoolboy got investigated by the FBI for joking about GWB)…stay away from their business instead of bitching on a tech blog.

If YouTube or any other web service has the so called “freedom of speech” then why do users have to accept the Terms of Service while signing up? Did anyone read that TOS? If any video is against that TOS it should be removed, that’s simple as that… And if you are not happy with that TOS then try to find a video service provider that doesn’t have a similar TOS (good luck in that)

Companies are bounded by laws and YouTube just deleted some videos that were violating its’ TOS. Simple as that…

If you want to talk about free speech then first criticize YouTube’s (an american company) TOS.

The regular citizenry can handle the humour, governments can’t. Having just said that all companies operating in foreign countries must abide by the rules and regulations of that host country, however stifling and intrusive and obtrusive they might appear to be. The World Courts is the place ( no matter the lop-sidedness of justice in that system) to take up the cause of “free speech” and have it apply to everyone no matter the risks in doing so. Or how righteous is the cause itself for the individual freedom.

ahhh the Americans… And the worse, the average Americans who has the IQ of an average Monkey…

It seems quite ironic that you live pathetic lives in a country that resembles a concentration camp, and at the same time, you’re so arrogant…

Just as corporations own and control your a**, they also do own YouTube.

Then tell me, why should they host non-sense videos entertain only a bunch of Greek retards, but offend a whole nation? Freedom of Speech?

HahA!

Tell me more of that Freedom of Speech considering Google vs. China case?

The case for your country is, more like Freedom of Corporations, don’t you get it?

The internet is here to provide freedom of speech and freedom of information.
Removing videos which are not allowed in turkey but everywhere else is like saying “we allow islam to make the rules worldwide”

This well orchestrated islamophobia may be the demise of US…

Today the attitudes of Americans towards Muslims somewhat resemble that of Germans towards Jews during mid 30’s. Also, the mechanisms that are used to drive these attitudes very well resemble the Freudian practices used by the Nazis to create hatred against Jews.

Turkey is a secular, democratic country (and its the only ally of US in the middle east region for over 50 years). And ironically, Ataturk, who is being insulted by these videos is the one who established modern, secular Turkish democracy. Removing these videos have nothing to do with free speech, it has more to do with respect and understanding, humanity.

Ah well, why am I telling all this… As indicated in one of the previous comments, the average American is a retard, and will never understand… That’s why the whole world should be concerned about their future… At least Germans were quite intelligent, but were forced to become slaves of their sub-conscious, dark, animal side…

meh…

cool blog!

Turkey should not be allowed to join the European Union