Initial thought is what about the security of the documents? Usually if somebody needs to sign something, the document itself contains some sensitive data?

Good stuff, I need this, many people do

Years ago I  sank some money into a company that was supposed to have solved the signature problem forever.  Their electronic signature product could be input via cheap devices, (writing pads, PDA’s ..etc), it had biometric authentication, and version control (i.e. further changes would invalidate the signature).   Great promise … to date I can’t figure out while this company did not take off

We did something similar a few years ago for an insurance company here in the UK as part of a workflow product we produced. There’s a huge business model if they can satisfy security and DR, (big risk for corporate clients). Our model included the secure storage of the printed documents as well, as we’re a printing company.

Interesting concept, but I’m not sure it’s a solution.

1 - because of confidentiality issues I’d need to ask every other party whether they consented to the use of a third-party service for this purpose.

2 - the email interface doesn’t seem to work with multiple recipients.

3 - I assume that the end product is an emailed pdf (perhaps I’m wrong), but the file size of an image pdf is much larger than one produced from the text file. At most, I want the sig pages scanned. This results in a smaller file size and a searchable, editable pdf.

I’m surprised you would be so dismissive of a business model. Unlike most of the services you write about, a business model here is easily envisionable.

PWB - All I said was I have no idea what it is. I also see business opportunities with this…

On behalf of EchoSign — We really appreciate the feedback .

Here are some of our thoughts on some of the points identified above…

Confidentiality - It’s critical to the success of EchoSign that our customers are confident that their documents are not view able by anybody other than the parties exchange the document for signature . We have intentionally designed a n automatic, secure system in which no human is involved in document exchange, and in which the documents are only accessible to the user with their passwords.

From a messaging perspective, we recognize that for certain of our users, ASP security is going to be an ongoing challenge - but we also see the parallels with email. Everyone is used to emailing their “sensitive docs” to each other - and each of the email providers, especially the webmail guys (gmail, yahoo, hotmail etc.) have even more access to these docs than we do. But this issue is still very valid. We’re hoping that efax, salesforce and gmail have blazed the trail for us.

E-signatures - We agree with “Z” that esignatures are still waiting to take off. That’s why our primary product uses the same workflow that everyone is comfortable with today - email as an attachment, print sign and fax back. If and when you want to use esignatures, you can e-sign through EchoSign as well (we enable this feature once you first send 3 docs out for regular fax signature). We think e-signatures are more useful in the short-term for signing agreements between parties that have ongoing relationships - such as standard PO’s between a supplier and a vendor, approvals of expense reports and general sign-offs of change orders.

And on multiple recipients - The feature is there, just not promoted yet. You can send a document to a dozen people to sign if, like other webmail services, you just list all the potential recipients in the “To” line separated by a comma or semicolon. It’s turned out to be a great way to get form compliance documents signed by multiple employees, for example (e.g., a new HR policy).

Please do keep the comments coming and we’ll use them to prioritize features in our coming releases.

As for the business model, the T&Cs seem to make it clear that the goal is to get the users to upgrade to paid accounts.

Just like eFax, there is a fair use policy in the T&Cs which require the user to upgrade to a paid account if the usage exceeds the number of pages considered fair use. Anyone who is doing a reasonable amount of business and is using this service will most likely exceed the fair use amount and will need to get a paid account.

This is a great product. If there are secure hashes, like PGP encryption keys that come with this to verify sender/receiver, this will seal the deal.

Meh.. they’ve gone half-way. They make the recipient FAX back in the document… so it goes from electronic to paper - gets signed and then back to digital…. There’s no audit trail. Aren’t there legal issues when a document goes from digital to paper & back again.. You can’t prove the original document is the same one the signer faxed back in again. You can’t prove they didn’t alter it and you can’t prove who signed it.

Has this system ever been tested in a court of law?

oh yeah .. and while I like some aspects .. making people FAX stuff is a pain in the ass.

Thank you for the recent feedback -

A few comments on items 11 & 12: (1) there is a clear audit trail in EchoSign now. Click on “History” on the Agreement page and you can see exact when a document was sent; signed by either party; and when copies were sent out. (2) We do make fax much much easier. But it can still be a pain. We also offer the web’s easiest (and only free) e-signature option - then you can sign in seconds. It’s turned out to be much more popular (vs. fax signatures) than we anticipated.

Jason Lemkin, CEO

I am confused or is this service basically a scanning and/or copying service? It seems like a lot of effort to put the client through, when really we are looking for a way to keep the file electronic the entire time, and not move it from one media format to another. I will say that I can see a benefit for users if they are a little uncertain about true ESIGN software, or if they just like fax machines.

Are they considering moving to a full service electronic signature model like Docusign, Adobe, Silanis or PrivaSign.com? Keeping the file in its electronic format is so much more effecient for both the sender and the recipient that I hope they will progress that way sooner rather than later, but as I said I do see some use for the service.

I also notice that Jason Lemkin mentions something about being the only free e-signature option. I am really not sure what that means? I see free signature options from everyone out there, and especially for the recipient which is what I believe he is referring to.

Lance

Lance - no scanning, no copying. Everything is in fact electronic already if you try it. You can try it free in seconds.

Better words than my own to describe some of what we’re doing:

http://www.simpleandloveable.c.....-made-easy

“so while we were midway through a skype call, they fired me the NDA through the online echosign service. I reviewed it, was happy, so gave my electronic agreement in echosign, and its done! No faxing (although it will fax or allow you to fax in if required), just a super simple way of confirming agreement between companies online.

Seconds later I had their business scope and strategy document in front of me and they were happily pouring their great ideas down the line, and after an hour we were close to coming to a deal. No time lags, no faxes, complete trust, everybody happy.”

Converting between electric and paper is definitely problematic for audit tracking as the versions are lost — whatever is faxed back can say anything they want.

As for the e-signatures, EchoSign may be fine for some, but there are many others doing this (most long before them), including Silanis, Yozons, Alamode, eOriginal, Sertifi, AlphaTrust, Entrust, RSA, iLumin….

The process for authentication a document is very important for document for be accepted is some office echo is doing a very good work in that area and in the process.,

Thanks echo.